The Ur-Quan Masters Discussion Forum

The Ur-Quan Masters Re-Release => Starbase Café => Topic started by: Justin Chang on March 29, 2004, 07:47:02 am



Title: Time Warp
Post by: Justin Chang on March 29, 2004, 07:47:02 am
Hey, it it just me or are the TW message boards down. Thanks


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Chrispy on March 29, 2004, 08:24:11 am
Why yes they are.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Baltar on March 30, 2004, 02:59:06 am
Oh yeah they are down alright :(  It seems as though the database has gone corrupt.  My hope is that PONAF has a recent backup of the files that we can just copy over the current ones.  Even if we do this, it's a temporary solution as there is no guarantee that the same thing won't happen again.  The hope is that with the backup copy we can save as much of the information in the forums as possible before pulling it off the server for good and setting up a new board service.  If there is no backup, or if complications prevent it's use, then the forums will be back to ground zero.

I emailed Chad over an PONAF over the weekend and have yet to hear a response.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Baltar on April 08, 2004, 05:39:44 am
Working with Chad and Gamespy support I have been able to set up a new board for Timewarp discussion.  Check it out here:

http://dynamic6.gamespy.com/~timewarp/phpBB2//index.php


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: youBastrd on April 16, 2004, 12:38:29 am
A correction: the Star Control: Timewarp project leaders have selected a different location for the project, which can be found here: http://timewarp.sourceforge.net/forum/.  The forum features an open, friendly atmosphere, and access to the actual developers of this great game.  Check it out!

The project's homepage is also in the process of moving.  Its new location is http://timewarp.sourceforge.net/.  

For those that are new to Timewarp, it's a game set in the Star Control universe.  It features many ships and gametypes, including the popular survival game "Gob," and supports hot-seat multiplayer (multiplayer on the same computer), as well as limited Internet multiplayer (presently up to two computers can be connected; work is proceeding on improving the multiplayer code).  

Be sure to check it out! http://timewarp.sourceforge.net/


As an aside, the list of people who can speak with authority about the Star Control: Timewarp project is located here: http://sourceforge.net/project/memberlist.php?group_id=13354


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: GeomanNL on April 17, 2004, 02:48:13 am
It actually supports 8 players on LAN ... I think. I heard no complaints about that sofar.

In the timewarp forums (follow youbstrds link please) you can also find the Public Plot Initiative, which is a public effort to make a ... plot. Check it out sometime, your vote also counts.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Baltar on April 17, 2004, 08:06:29 am
The above is of course, a mistake.  The official forums of Timewarp are still attached to the main Timewarp site at http://www.classicgaming.com/starcontrol/timewarp.  Again the link to our new and improved forum:

http://dynamic6.gamespy.com/~timewarp/phpBB2//index.php


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: youBastrd on April 17, 2004, 02:35:31 pm
Ok, so there's some controversy about where the Timewarp forums actually are.  We'll post a more definative result when the dust settles, but its final home should reside at one of the two URLs listed here.  

  • http://timewarp.sourceforge.net/forum/
    • Posts made to here will actually be read and responded to by the countless artists, writers, developers, etc, who actively volunteer many thousands of work-hours each month to actually make the game Timewarp.  

  • http://dynamic6.gamespy.com/~timewarp/phpBB2//index.php
      Made by the group of folks known as Team Beige, which consists of "Baltar, Dragst, and a few others."


Guys, let's keep things civil in here please.  We've all said our piece, there's no need to further repeat ourselves or contribute to a flamewar.  Users are confused enough by what's going on, and we've got our respecive games to work on. :)


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: SorenV on April 18, 2004, 02:37:35 am
Perhaps being an outside users, I'm easily confused... Perhaps not, but when I see the biased, and rather one sided language that you used... And then I see a request for a word.... "civil"

I can't help but think of a completely different word- "Hypocrite".


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: youBastrd on April 18, 2004, 03:40:43 am
Quote
... being an outside users[sic]...
So there's actually a bunch of information that's not privy to end users.  One tidbit is that with all the swearing and abuse on Baltar's forum, most of the developers have basicially left that forum in disgust.  Since the administrator himself has so blatently violated the user agreements of the hosting servers, and the user agreement for the forum (which he himself uploaded!), the forum will surely make life difficult for end users.  So any comments made there are largely going to remain unread by the people who actually make the game.  

So users can make up their own, unbiased, minds as to where to go.  

Thanks for the post, SorenV, I hope you like the game!


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Baltar on April 18, 2004, 05:28:46 am
Unbiased indeed.  youBastrd's post seems to suggest that the split between these two site occured solely because of some abusive conduct on our part in the TW forums.  Nothing could be further from the truth.  The core of this issue is simply that youBastrd is a relative newcomer to the project but has completely usurped a number of much older members such as myself and Dragst.  Here is an excerpt from our own boards:

Quote
This all comes down to a difference of opinion between yB and the story team. We haven't seen eye to eye ever since he first appeared on the TW scene. In fact, he basically just assumed the role of a 'boss' trying to dictate to us how things are going to be. We don't appreciate this, and trying to talk with him about it gets nowhere. Since his appearance last year he has completely marginalized the story team. In his view, we basically don't exist since we work in secret. You can imagine how upset this makes us when we've been working as members of this project for quite some time when suddenly this new guy comes along and tries to redefine what the project is and who its members are!

At this point, I'm basically throwing up my hands in disgust and giving up on TW. I've talked to him repeatedly, and his view is no different than a year ago when he first showed up. He's hijacked the direction of this project and we aren't in a position to seriously challenge him. He claims his new vision is 'community based' but I see little reason to take that seriously. Certainly given his demeanor during past communications with him, he really isn't interested in the opinions of others. Time and time again, he says his time is too precious to be spent chit-chating, etc. He's regarded my past discussions with him as 'complaints'....not in the 'constructive criticism sense', but more the 'nagging' sense. By his own admission, he's really only concerned about building his resume. 'Community based' indeed. Anyone else see a conflict of interest here?


I will readily admit that some abusive language (although not from myself as yB seems to suggest) came from our party, but the nature of this situation has forced us to be defensive.  Even so I wonder just what 'user agreement' he is talking about.  I just did a brief perusal of the phpbb end user agreement and saw nothing in there in which phpbb dicates exactly which communications can/cannot occur via their software.

Speaking of agreements, youBastrd informed me some weeks back that he was pushing Timewarp development for participation in a contest involving cash prizes.  I find this quite unsettling in that it suggests that he'd attempt to earn money off of another's ideas (TW, of course, being based heavily on Star Control).  Also of note is the fact that the licensing agreement has been missing from the most recent releases of TW.  I'm not sure whether or not that is a mistake.  If it isn't, there's another legal issue here has Public License products are not legally able to be converted to something that isn't.  Incidentally, this isn't the first time a coder in TW has played with licensing and pushed the product to further their own fame/fortune, but that is a story for another day.

Anywho, hopefully that is enough background for you to make an unbiased decision on.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: SorenV on April 18, 2004, 06:01:34 am
Hmmm... Baltar, would I be right in assuming that the other coder you are referring to was Tau?  That guy a long while back that got everyone pissed off?

One thing though yB... You blame Baltar and the other team members for inflamatory language... Yet was it not you, who allowed your "brother" (hehehehe) to post rather insulting posts on Baltar's boards.  Also, does it not seem odd that it happened after Baltar deleted your (rather obnoxious) advertisements for your own forums from his board and website?

I don't know why, but that just doesn't seem to add up.  At all.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: GeomanNL on April 18, 2004, 06:54:24 am
Are you people actually going to continue the argument in the UQM forums ?? I hope not.



Anywho, hopefully that is enough background for you to make an unbiased decision on.

An unbiased decision can only be made if you compare original material from the two parties, not just one.





Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Baltar on April 18, 2004, 09:06:13 am
Quote
Are you people actually going to continue the argument in the UQM forums ?? I hope not.


Well, yB kinda pressed the issue when he 1) claimed that his own site was the 'official' site of Timewarp and 2) attempted to spread disinformation by claiming the split is the result of abusive conduct perpentrated by my party.


Quote
An unbiased decision can only be made if you compare original material from the two parties, not just one.


Which is exactly what has happened, no?  yB pointed out abusive behavior on our part, and I pointed out that the 'official'-ness of any site/board is still quite under dispute.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: GeomanNL on April 18, 2004, 09:29:11 am
No, you gave an additional selection of facts and opinions to support your view ; people can't check their correctness by an independent source. Therefore, until youbstrd responds to your post and comments on the new content, people may still get a biased view.


edit:
Arguments: you're both to blame. One of you has to make a decision to stop posting about the conflict here, sofar neither of you did.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Baltar on April 18, 2004, 09:49:43 am
Quote
One of you has to make a decision to stop posting about the conflict here, sofar neither of you did.


No, BOTH parties need to come to that conclusion.  yB hasn't, and I can't stand by while he spreads disinformation.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Ivan Ivanov on April 18, 2004, 02:25:25 pm
I like you guys, you're funny. I realy laughed my ass of when I saw the flamewars on Channel 44.

If I understand this right, the problems started because the programming team didn't recognize the hard work of the story team.
Can't realy say I blame them.
I can understand that the plot needs to be kept secret from the public, but when I first discovered Time Warp (1-2 years ago), form time to time on the TW forums someone asked a question like "I wonder what is/are the Orz?" or "What is this round space ship in the end scenes of SC2?". There was always someone from the story team that replied with something close to "I know something, I won't tell! Ha ha ha ha ha!!!"
I assure you this CAN piss someone off.

I also can't blame the story team from keeping the plot secret. Who would wan't to play a game, that he knows, how it's going to end?

But there is a pretty obvious way you guys can reach a settlement:
The story team can reveal the plot ONLY to the programming team!
This way:
1) the plot would still be kept secret form the public
2) the story team could get a second opinion about their work
2) the programming team would be forced to recognize all of the sotry team's work
3) the programming team would know what is expected from the game engine

Voila! World peace at last!
Unless of course all this rumbling about the story is just an excuse.
But I think it would be best if you reached some kind of agreement. The current state of things makes you all look very childish, silly and generally un-serious.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: Lukipela on April 18, 2004, 05:05:48 pm
Ok, stop it. Both of you. The reason I'm on this board and the SC board, rather than on Channel 44 has been made blatantly clear in this thread. This is a site for the SC community and UQM development, not an extension of your private feuding grounds. TW has, for as long as I can remember been assoicated with unneccessary drama and inflamed egos. While we of course appreciate that you want to build a sequel, we'd rather see an end product than pointless banter about why it isn't happening. Keep your arguments on your own sites, and preferably private.

Usually I don't suggest things like this, but maybe a mod should lock this thread? I see no gain whatsoever for the UQM forum by having the TW drama spill over to this side. Anyone who truly cares about the issue can visit the links provided, and make up their own minds. Now shush. I prefer a quiet forum to a soap opera.


Title: Re: Time Warp
Post by: meep-eep on April 18, 2004, 08:34:36 pm
I'm locking this topic. For the good of mankind etc.