The Ur-Quan Masters Discussion Forum

The Ur-Quan Masters Re-Release => General UQM Discussion => Topic started by: UniAce on December 15, 2002, 10:51:42 am



Title: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: UniAce on December 15, 2002, 10:51:42 am
I think it'd be neat to share experience as far as really obscure bits of dialogue and/or details in SC2.  In some other threads I've read I noticed someone mentioned sort of an outtake in the spoken version of some Druuge line, and also something about the Druuge commenting on you ripping them off if you pull some fuel-tank-filling trick.

I'd like to hear other interesting/funny bits from throughout the game that perhaps not many people would be likely to stumble upon.  And maybe if you could share tips without making it a total spoiler, it'd be more fun for others to go off and try to find the things on their own.

Maybe the fine folks working on the re-release might even stumble upon some bit of dialogue in the code that you can't actually ever reach in the game (through some error)!  Wouldn't that be something?


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Dave Morse on December 15, 2002, 11:21:29 am
Well you could just listen to all the sound files for the dialog... ;D


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Kari Nurmi on December 15, 2002, 03:27:25 pm
Two pretty obscure bits would be the Melnorme giving you fuel for free (when you're stranded with absolutely nothing they can strip from your ship and no bio) and the Melnorme telling you about the time the Spathi accidentally genocided the Algolites. (When you piss them off to a degree, then attempt to make amends)


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Teric on December 16, 2002, 07:24:17 pm
I'm sure everybody knows that Buenos Aires (captial of Argentina) got blown away by the Ur-Quan, but I heard/read it for the first time the other day.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Azarule on December 17, 2002, 02:08:05 am
What ?  Am I the only one who apparently didn't get that ?


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: PsiPhi on December 17, 2002, 10:32:37 am
Yes, I always wondered, of all the famous cities of the world, among them, Rome, Moscow, Beijing, Tokyo, London, Buenos Aires, and Washington, why Buenos Aires ... WHY Fred and Paul WHY WHY ... ok, I'm done.

I think what I always found far more interesting though was this,
"In some cases, the Ur-Quan destroyed places we did not even suspect were significant.  From their positions in orbit, the Dreadnoughts blew away a kilometer of land in central Iraq, vaporized several targets in the Amazon rain forest, punched a big hole through the Antarctic icecap to destroy something deep under the surface, and melted a broad swath of the ocean floor in the south-eastern Atlantic."

What do you think these were?  I always thought the south-eastern Atlantic one was a joke about Atlantis and maybe that the Amazon and Antarctica were somehow connected.  And that central Iraq was somehow related to the garden of Eden.

-PsiPhi


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Parker on December 17, 2002, 11:14:29 am
Quote
What do you think these were?  I always thought the south-eastern Atlantic one was a joke about Atlantis and maybe that the Amazon and Antarctica were somehow connected.  And that central Iraq was somehow related to the garden of Eden.

Precursor artifacts/ships/installations of course!


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: PsiPhi on December 17, 2002, 11:19:00 am
Quote

Precursor artifacts/ships/installations of course!

Yeah, I know that was stated in another part of the game, but it doesn't eliminate the potentional for the formation of certain human mythology.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Dave Morse on December 17, 2002, 12:57:29 pm
Quote
Yes, I always wondered, of all the famous cities of the world, among them, Rome, Moscow, Beijing, Tokyo, London, Buenos Aires, and Washington, why Buenos Aires ... WHY Fred and Paul WHY WHY ... ok, I'm done.


As a nod to Starship Troopers.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Parker on December 17, 2002, 01:06:18 pm
Quote


As a nod to Starship Troopers.

I hope you're joking ;)

Maybe it was the other way around?


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Nic. on December 17, 2002, 02:49:20 pm
The book, not the movie.

At least I hope..  :)


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: PsiPhi on December 17, 2002, 09:01:58 pm
Yes, that's right.  Heinlein wrote the book in the late 1950's.   Johnny Rico was from Buenos Aires and it gets destroyed by a bug attack, making him think both his parents are dead.  I read the book after I played this game the first time (and before I ever saw that movie), so I wonder if Fred and Paul were giving a nod to Heinlein's story.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Parker on December 17, 2002, 09:21:18 pm
Ah, I had never heard of the book.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: PsiPhi on December 17, 2002, 09:28:48 pm
A lot of people haven't.  I mean, the movie was made almost 40 years later and I felt it was totally different from the book.  Parts of the story were completely changed.  Read that book.  It will totally change your mind about the movie, especially if you enjoyed the movie.  They just didn't do it justice.  I mean, what happened to the body armor!?  Anyway, it was an excellent point brought up by David Morse.

Newbie status, goodbye!


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Scott on December 18, 2002, 05:46:48 am
I heard that the bugs weren't even actual bugs in the book.. they're like robots or something. Is that true?


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Dave Morse on December 18, 2002, 06:55:30 am
They're real bugs, but there are only 4 types: Worker, Warrior, Brain, Queen.  No "Orbital Defense Fart Bugs".

But the bugs were /not/ the cool part of ST.  In fact they were totally generic.  The coolest part of ST was the powered armor.  AFAIK this was the first serious Sci-Fi appearance of what is now an anime staple.  And when they went to translate it into the movie they just decided to drop it because it wasn't "essential" to what they were trying to do.

I think the movie was trying to make fun of fascism.  And make fun of the fact that most people wouldn't know fascism unless it had Nazi(TM) stamped on it.

I'm not sure if the book was also trying to make fun of fascism, or if it was secretly advocating it, or just trying to present the facts in an unbiased light.  I guess the latter, but would be interested to know what others think.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Casey Monroe on December 19, 2002, 02:36:25 am
The reason why the suits were dropped from the movie is because the outsides of the suits would all look exactly the same, and no one would be able to tell which characters were which--not to mention the fact that it would preclude any opportunity for "acting".  Of course, considering how ST went, maybe it would have been better that way...


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Dave Morse on December 19, 2002, 03:02:21 am
A Starship Troopers adaptation without powered armor is like Moby Dick with no whale.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Niahak on December 19, 2002, 03:53:49 am
I would say the Starship Troopers movie was OK on its own...
The fact is, a movie made directly from the book probably wouldn't make that good a movie.
What's so fun about some guy bounding off hills launching nukes everywhere?
Although the planet (don't remember name)scene would've been cool.  And the launch system, too.
I don't think it would preclude acting, since suits could be different for each person.
Oh yeah, and in the book Dizzy was male.  So they couldn't have had that excuse for the topless scene(s?).  ;D
All in all, I'd watch a more loyal remake, but I don't know if the general populace would like it.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Danny Powell on December 19, 2002, 10:40:52 am
Quote
I think what I always found far more interesting though was this,
"In some cases, the Ur-Quan destroyed places we did not even suspect were significant.  From their positions in orbit, the Dreadnoughts blew away a kilometer of land in central Iraq, vaporized several targets in the Amazon rain forest, punched a big hole through the Antarctic icecap to destroy something deep under the surface, and melted a broad swath of the ocean floor in the south-eastern Atlantic."


Reading through that makes me think of the Cthulhu mythos as many of those places are important in it.  Cthulhu and his ilk are huge strange god-like aliens and infact Cthulhu isn't too disimilar from an Ur-Quan.  Cthulhu is 'currently' trapped in a deep sleep in a space ship at the bottom of the atlantic.  There was a great pre-human city located in Antartica and the Necrominicom was written by a 'mad Arab'.  Don't know if it's just coincidence but that's the first thing it made me thing of.

Danny


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Black Monk on December 19, 2002, 09:16:32 pm
A ton of the book was introspective thoughts by the protagonist.  In a visual media people want visual action, not someone sitting around thinking about things while a voiceover yaps about getting over the hump in boot camp or hearing about his father dying, etc.

A direct translation to the movie screen would have had very limited mass appeal and would have been long and boring.  

'sides, Dizzy had a topless scene!  Mmmmm...


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Chax on December 20, 2002, 03:55:50 am
 ::)

None of you have it right
take it from someone who's parents were close friends to the author.  

it has NOTHING to do with Facism or whatever, it is another method of goverment that Heinline put foreward, and to me works a lot better then our current one.

There were more forms of bugs then just 4, there were the acid bugs which were shown in the movie as well.

Heinline was a fantastic author and a very good friend to my parents.  I respect the creators for reconizing him, i only wish i was born soon enough to meet him like my sisters..


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Dave Morse on December 20, 2002, 05:50:03 am
Quote
it has NOTHING to do with Facism or whatever, it is another method of goverment that Heinline put foreward, and to me works a lot better then our current one.

I regard the central tenet of Fascism to be that the individual's needs are subservient to the needs of the state.  ST seemed to have a sort of two tiered, semi-fascist system: citizens (i.e. willing fascists), and non-citizens (who enjoyed most of the advantages of American citizens, but not the right to vote).  Its interesting how the balance was struck, and how that gets rid of some of the nasty problems with fascism - like when you get too old to be productive you have to jump off a cliff.

Of course the other tendancy of fascism is to put forward a Mussolini style charismatic leader.  ST definately didn't have that.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Captain Smith on December 21, 2002, 06:08:23 pm
Quote
I think it'd be neat to share experience as far as really obscure bits of dialogue and/or details in SC2.  I


To answer this original question, see my thread about pissing off things - I put in there how to do it so it's kind of a spoiler, but seeing the dialogue and doing it is kinda fun and shows a different part of the game...


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Nic. on December 21, 2002, 09:44:52 pm
I just found one that I thought was pretty obscure:

Head to the Ilwrath homeworld and talk to them.  Not through the Hyperwave 'caster, just as yourself.  They will let you ask them all sorts of questions, and if you ask them about their religion prior to Dogar and Kazon, they will tell you that, in antiquity, they worshipped many gods, including "Awk of the Seds"  :)


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Ishamael on December 24, 2002, 04:33:35 am
Um...what is the "Awk of the Seds" reference about?  I'm not translating properly or something....   ???


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Nic. on December 24, 2002, 04:55:15 am
Executive summary:  They're what we had to use before Perl came along.  They are quite infamous for their ability to be mis-used, e.g., people write amazingly convoluted sed scripts where a one-line awk script would suffice, and vice-versa.

See here (http://www.mcsr.olemiss.edu/cgi-bin/man-cgi?awk) and here (http://www.mcsr.olemiss.edu/cgi-bin/man-cgi?sed) for a full explanation. ;)


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: unigolyn on January 28, 2003, 11:47:18 pm
Quote

I regard the central tenet of Fascism to be that the individual's needs are subservient to the needs of the state.  ST seemed to have a sort of two tiered, semi-fascist system: citizens (i.e. willing fascists), and non-citizens (who enjoyed most of the advantages of American citizens, but not the right to vote).  Its interesting how the balance was struck, and how that gets rid of some of the nasty problems with fascism - like when you get too old to be productive you have to jump off a cliff.


That's not the central tenet of just Fascism - it's the central tenet of every collectivist political philosophy.

And Paul Verhoeven's cinematic accomplishments notwithstanding - he's a moron when it comes to interpreting Heinlein. The society put forth in Starship Troopers isn't Fascist at all - it's a democratic meritocracy. It's not fascism, just a form of democracy that's different from the ones we have. Basically, citizenship (i.e. voting and eligibility for public office) is not a right - it is a privilege to be earned. EVERYONE has an opportunity to earn it, it's just not automatically given to everyone. And I have to say I agree - running a government (by picking who runs it) isn't something anyone can do just cause they want to. After all, the poster boy of fascism, Adolf Hitler was ELECTED, because people were deceived by his talk of grandeur and racist rhetoric. And Heinlein's 'federal service' certainly includes political education, making a retired Starship Trooper better equipped to vote for a competent leader instead of some slick powerhungry politician (note: no one in actual military service is allowed to vote, or serve in public office, you get citizenship AFTER service). And most Heinlein fans agree that 'federal service' was actually a much larger concept than mere military service, since the failure rate in military recruitment was a whopping 99 percent.

The society itself wasn't fascist at all, it was clearly a free, capitalist society. In the movie, Rico's parents were highly against citizenship and the federation, and had no qualms in voicing their disapproval. There is no freedom of expression in a fascist society, especially expression that's critical of the government.

Verhoeven proved himself an idiot when he called Starship Troopers a fascist book and made a movie where they all wear Nazi uniforms. Oddly, he did include the egalitarian nature of book - all races and all sexes have equal standing in the government and military, and the space fleet is actually largely dominated by women.

As a shoot 'em up sci fi action movie, however, I loved ST to pieces, and I still love Verhoeven's movies, especially Total Recall.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Death 999 on January 29, 2003, 12:17:50 am
The bugs are still bugs, mostly. I mean, they're aliens, but they're kind of in a way LIKE terran bugs.
However, the book is about 10 orders of magnitude better than the movie. It's like,

Book = Sa-Matra (deployed for battle, not in the asteroid field)

movie = Tanaka's scout


Title: Hee hee hee...
Post by: Cyamarin on January 29, 2003, 09:44:10 pm
...that was good.


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Matticus on February 04, 2003, 10:45:39 pm
This one isn't all that obscure (to me anyway) but it really struck me when I read it. If you've never talked to the Umgah before they become controlled you can ask them if they know any good jokes. This is the response:

JOKE. YES. JOKE. HERE. IS. JOKE. WHEN. IS. A. SLAVE. NOT. A. SLAVE. ANSWER. WHEN. HE. IS. A. SLAVE. MASTER.

Very telling when you consider who it is that's controlling the Umgah.

If you probe further they tell you a second joke:

BETTER. JOKE. YES. BETTER. JOKE. HERE. IT. IS WHAT. YOU. GET. WHEN. COMBINE. DEUTERIUM. PELLET. TERRAWATT. LASER. AND. PRIMITIVE. EARTH. LEADER. FROM. ASIAN. STEPPES. ANSWER. KHAN. FUSION.

Har! Har! Har! Funny Umgah blobbies!


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Lukipela on February 04, 2003, 10:56:38 pm
I only had this come up once during my conversations with the Melnorme, but I found it hilarious :

"This very morning, I was just saying to subordinate Ochre
`Fe-Fi-Fo-Fum! I smell the feet of a Hu-Hu-Man!'
We laughed and laughed. What a synchronicity!"


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: UniAce on February 13, 2003, 10:00:07 am
Hey these are great!  I've never heard most of them!  Thanks all


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Kohr-Ah_Primat on April 10, 2003, 04:35:04 am
Quote
Although the planet (don't remember name)scene would've been cool.  And the launch system, too.


...Kathmandu?

Quote
I cannot believe what I have just heard.
Captain, you are a heinous SLAVE-TRADER!
Your exchanges with the Druuge have become a horror story throughout the starbase!
If anyone here is stupid enough to join your crew, I expect the RU cost will be skyhigh.
If you weren't our only hope for freedom, Captain
I'd kill you where you stand.
As it is, expect me to bring charges against you when this is all over.

That would have to be the most obscure thing I'd ever encounter in my gameplay--in fact I don't think I've actually encountered it; as evil as I am, I can't stomach the idea of selling out my own race. Other races, on the other hand....


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Culture20 on April 10, 2003, 05:32:53 am
If there's an obscure quote out there somewhere, Khor-Ah Primat will dredge it up in her quest to respond to every post in every thread.  ::)


Title: Re: Most Obscure Bit of Dialogue and/or Detail?
Post by: Kohr-Ah_Primat on April 10, 2003, 05:38:35 am
*chuckles* That's right! I'm on a quest to cause undue suffering and misery to all!