The Ur-Quan Masters Discussion Forum

For a long time (around five years) I've been tossing around a fanfic. This is the thread for discussing that fanfic. I have posted it in a different thread so that  it can be read without interruption. Said thread is here:
http://forum.uqm.stack.nl/index.php?topic=4032.0


Three notes:

1: there is more. I just haven't put the italics into bbcode yet.
(edit: I have caught up and written past where I was when I started. Things will be slower from here on)

B) there is a lot of 'fanon' I had to make up, of course. Don't rely on this as being strictly right.

III - in fact, don't even rely that it strictly fits within existing canon. You may note that the Druuge conversation goes slightly out of order in the first section. Further events occur which cannot occur within the game engine, and would reasonably be expected to be represented if they occurred. This does not bother me. If it bothers you, well, I'm so very sorry but that's how it goes.

Good read so far. Keep it coming!

Thank you! I was wondering what people thought.

What was your least favorite part? I'm not above fixing things or cutting dull parts.


I'll be able to put up the second half of what I've got tomorrow.

Not so much a 'least favorite part' per se, but I think it would be neat to know more of what Peeru thought of the other Alliance races. The Druuge perspective is unique (ie, always evaluating races based on profitability/exploitability potential). So their views on the Pkunk, for example, might be very interesting. Perhaps the Druuge also have prior dealings with some of the Alliance races which could provide some interesting back story.

Otherwise, I enjoyed reading it and look forward to future installments.  8)

I like it a lot! I love stories from the POV of non-human races, and working from the perspective of a Druuge captain... Ha, it's very enjoyable. :3

There were a couple things that bugged me:

You spend a lot of time with Peeru's thoughts, and not much time on-- I don't want to say the physical, exactly, but a bit more description of the environments, of how things LOOK to Peeru, or how Peeru herself reacts to all these things, or even "she felt disgusted that whatsisface broke off the whachum because of her lack of femininity" instead of her thinking how disgusted she is.

Your Zelnick also strikes me as a bit too... collected. Whether you play the game as a nice guy or not, he's kind of a tactless dork a lot of the time, and while smart, he's not always aware of what's going on. (GLOWY BITS! much? XD)

Also, purely a formatting thing, but putting an extra paragraph break between paragraphs makes text easier to read online, especially since indenting isn't exactly easy on forums. XD

Still, DESPITE ALL THAT, I really enjoyed what you have up, and I'm definitely looking forward to more~! This is a great idea, and you're pulling it off far better than I would have expected.

Angus: As far as prior Druuge contact with other alliance races is concerned, I'm thinking 'no' to those we've met. They're all really far away. Perhaps Syreen and Yehat, when we meet them. I have a lot of interesting plans around them.
As far as commercial exploitation, heh. You'll see tomorrow.

Ala...chan:
As far as appearance is concerned, I tried to do all that, but I found that it would take slightly longer than what I've put up so far for her to get into her ship! I am trying to not get bogged down in what she considers totally ordinary, which is near sensory deprivation aside from her knee-mounted displays (Thinking back on it, I didn't mention that detail in what I've put down here... added!), by the design of the crimson corporation. Descriptions will be much more detailed when it comes time for her to leave the ship, which is soon, because she is unfamiliar with the environment. And because the environment will have more than dull gray walls and towers and chains chosen to keep one's attention on one's knees.
(edited to add: oops. I forgot she did leave the ship. Well, I added a little more detail. Hmm. just thought of some more.)

You're right, I haven't got Zelnick's 'voice' down. Still, it's possible to avoid some of those really wacky dialogue options. I had a hard time conceiving of someone who would take such options being able to lead effectively. Also, he's been at this for several years. He's not following the walkthrough, after all. But all that aside, you're right. I'll see if I can work that in earlier than I have.

Formatting fixed.

Thanks!

You can just call me Alana, if you like. :3

But you're writing the story from 3PPOV-- limited third person, yes, but you can still mention things that don't actually fall under her attention because they're so very mundane. You've obviously thought a lot about your worldbuilding and the structure of the Corporation, so put some of that to use! Frex, In my fanfic I'm writing from the POV of a VUX, just because he KNOWS that the way you treat an injured head-tentacle is immobilizing the injured part in a stiff wrapping, and even though he KNOWS that he adores Admiral ZEX (but thinks ZEX can be a thrice-damned idiot about humans), doesn't mean my readers know it, too-- so there's no harm in me describing him wrapping an injured head-tentacle to immobilize it, or in me describing "He hissed in quiet fustration; as loyal as he was to his Admiral, he wished ZEX would just shut up about Humans."

(But then, I'm a bit of a sucker for description. XD SO MY OPINION IS A BIT BIASED.)

See, I don't think that Zelnick being a tactless dork makes him unfit to be a leader-- it's more important that he can think and act quickly, and that he can organize the people working with him. Not having anything blocking the path between your brain and your mouth doesn't mean that your brain can't work perfectly well~ and while I agree that, after several years, he might have gained some seriousness, even dialog options that shouldn't show up until "late" in the game have his particular brand of "charm" about them.

... oh dear, uh, this is all personal interpretation. XD *Loves debating* Don't take anything I say too seriously~ I have pretty strong opinions, and lack anything blocking the path between my brain and my fingers. :D (There's a reason I find Zelnick a very identifiable protagonist!)

Masterful.

My wishlist:
* I'd like to read more about those Arilou. When I played the game, I often imagine the crew interaction in my final, heavily multi-racial entourage, and I always wondered exactly how two races that, in terms of philosophy and general approach to life, are so nearly polar opposites as the Arilou and Druuge, would get along. Also, the Arilou is my favourite SC race, along with the Yehat and Melnorme.

* Speaking of which, it'd be great if they encounter Melnorme at some point -- we'd get to learn more about the conflict between the Melnorme and the Druuge.

In my opinion, it's perfectly all right to be not-entirely-canon-compatible, especially when you're writing about a game setting. Speculate! My favourite SCWC fanfic is "Honour", a lot of how we get to see Yehat society in there has next to no basis in the game, but it's great anyway. Likewise with a lot of the Starflight fanfiction -- they're stories set in the game, not retellings of the game. The author gets to have some creative control -- even in a fanfic. As long as you don't do something blatantly stupid, like involving battlemechs, Imperial Star Destroyers or magical Anime girls, I won't complain.

As for Zelnick's voice, I generally think of Zelnick as a character who develops throughout the story. He's very young when he suddenly finds himself captain of the precursor vessel, when the original captain dies. You can pretty much expect him to be a bit immature in the beginning of the story. I think you nailed my impression of an older, more galaxy-smart Zelnick pretty well -- although, perhaps, Zelnick would be more prone to letting off a joke every now and then.

But, as said, masterful. Keep it up.

Dreadnought is spelled with an O. (Real comments coming later.)

Aww *blush*


Even if you hadn't asked, you would have received. These are too juicy to pass up.


Orz marine suits, Hierarchy capships, and psychic purple space amazons are as close as I'm planning on getting.


I doubt you can find more than the tersest conversation in this fanfic in which he doesn't tell a joke. Many of them are no good. That's part of my point.
But also, I imagine that he is a lot more flamboyant when speaking with those he isn't familiar with, as a defense mechanism. Look how sharp his conversation options with Hayes are. You don't get to see him in much conversations like that in the game, of course.

EP:  ::) :D


Okay, so I put up Part 6. It's a lot less than I promised, but I had something dumb I decided to cut from part 7 and I need to check it over to make sure everything remains consistent with its absence.

Well; the Druuge society breaking canon bothers me a little personally, but since it's necessary to have the Druuge actually make interesting characters, it's a good departure. Same for the combat dynamics not quite matching the ships' abilities in melee.

Overall, I like it a lot. There's only a few places that seem forced or awkward to me. To be honest, those are the places where you don't break canon. It feels like you're just writing certain alien characters (the Druuge and Pkunk in particular) how you know they're supposed to be without really understanding them.

Anyway, good work! And find-and-replace "Dreadnaught" already. :P

How so? I think there's considerable room within the canon for interpretation of Druuge, so long as you realize that all of the Druuge you get to talk to in-game are not in typical positions, and are most heavily monitored, etc. If there is a company line, they'll have to hew to it most closely.

You must have something specific in mind here, so I'd like to know.


If you are referring to anything beyond the obvious changes...
- More than two ships in a battle
- continuous fire angles
- three dimensions
- Ur-Quan fighters can be instructed to stick around
- less well-measured ship stats are simulated in varying ways intentionally
... I'd like to know, so I can be making these changes consciously.
Or if you mean a marauder accelerating hard, I of course mean as hard as it can. It doesn't need to be all that fast to hurl a FRIED an unexpectedly large way off to the side.


Pkunk, yes. It's hard to write them consistent with the story without playing them to the hilt, and I'm not sure it'd be worthwhile.

I hope to get into more of the whys of Druuge society in a bit (not sure where to fit it in), and that may alleviate this feeling in respect to them.

~~~~~
Tweaks made. I adjusted the first part to fill in some details (most notably adding a small section before what was the beginning), and executed 's/dreadnaught/dreadnought/g'

Yes - I don't think a Crimson Corporation employee ever has the leisure to act on a personal grudge.


Well, the stuff you listed, the fact that space doesn't wrap (which makes Druuge vs Earthling much harder) and the fact that ships can be partially disabled instead of just losing crew.

Oh, right, those modifications. Yup.


Anyone can do that if they can arrange plausible pretext. Then the Corporation does the punishing. Observant people will piece together why, but officially it was disinterested. VP's have a lot more leeway to generate such reasons for the Corporation to punish the employee than normal managers.

Or do you mean to further imply that they do not have the leisure time to have personal relationships of any kind at all?

Also, I wonder whether you think the Pkunks' representation in parts 10 and 11 breaks up the charicature impression.

Yes, or at least personal relationships as we know them.

Yes, it seems more natural now.

On the relationship front, I do not think that allowing that there might be some free time at all would be a continuity violation, that's all.

I have tweaked part 10. Most significantly,
- We learn in the training segment with Tinkafo that Peeru's interface is not immersive.
- I lengthened Kaandor's argument with Martin four more lines so as to reveal that the Druuge have variable magnification telescopic eyes.

And in parts 2 and 3:
- It is clarified that Peeru has her personal effects from home.
- Peeru's departure from the Vindicator was cut, being dumb.
- Peeru's thoughts about the safety net have been cleared up to be more consistent with Druuge economic considerations.

I have not begun part 12. Further updates as events warrant.

More tweaks, principally:
2: I incorporated an overview of the situation that has a more plausible history behind it, in particular incorporating the hints they received from the arilou homeworld: Syreen location known, No more Androsynth.
The Arilou homeworld hint about the mycon isn't conclusive enough IMO to contradict his not knowing about the deep child egg cases.
Added Tanaka.

10: extended the discussion of where to go, mentioned getting the VUX beast already. I do have a consistent line of reasoning leading to the order of portals, and we get a hint of that here.

(
central - arilou - while going back with no spawner. That it returns to same point suggests that these portals lead to consistent places, but it's no guarantee.
NE, closest to arilou home - arilout alternate
closest to center without being center - Ilwrath
looks like a pattern so far, with QS being a rotation and contraction of HS. Test this by heading off to one side
SSE portal - Yehat-Mycon-Vux portal. This hypothesis looks good, but it does mean almost all of the QS portals are off the map. Let's try one.
far W portal (Delta Lyncis). Well, crud. One last try, get the fourth corner...
N portal - Druuge. Okay, no pattern. Take it clockwise from here.
)

I added to part 11. Part 12 is tentatively complete, and has been posted. You may notice that I changed some Druuge names to make them consistent with the pattern of druuge captain names. However, I'm thinking of going and keeping the old ones anyway. Some of the new ones are just dumb-sounding. Also, I'm still trying to settle the year length, which is why there are some rather... long... sounding time spans listed here. Just keep in mind it's not an Earth year.

Now the news is out of the way -- I asked what peoples' least favorite bits were. What are your favorite parts?

I zapped part 12 on the grounds that it sucked.

I'll be backing off on the tightness of the narrative - that is, I'll have bigger gaps between scenes - so we can get somewhere in the story before it drags on too long.

All right! Update! I added two more sections.

Thoughts?

After ignoring these two threads for months, I read the whole thing from start to finish just now. Seems decent. The thing I like least about this fanfic is how confusing it gets with the names, especially when you've got the three flavors of Zoq-Fot-Pik, Pkunk, Arilou and Spathi all running around. It gets disorienting. I would appreciate it if you described the non-human, non-Druuge characters in a little more detail. You've got the Druuge nailed down pretty well IMO.

EP said you had the combat mechanics wrong without going into much detail. The only one that struck me was that you had a Slylandro Probe catch a Pkunk Fury over an extended chase. This would not happen in the game. The Pkunk Fury's top speed is 64, while the Probe only moves at 60. I could personally care less about this. The combat mechanics you're using fit the game well enough for my taste.

What? I thought they were *exactly the same speed*. Oops. I could indicate that Jay was actually doing fine when going around, that he was stringing it along going under top speed- and that only when Jay took the hard turn did it really catch up.
(edit: it looks like I can't change those old posts. Hmm.)

Should I post the character list? Broken up by chapter?

Especially towards the end, we several new crewmembers not previously seen are introduced without coming 'on-camera' -- Heeran, and Nuun. And Trifop suddenly gains prominence.

Which non-human-or-druuge characters are you thinking of? There are Jay, Tippy, Porm and Koos, Tifiwilo... and a bunch of background characters like Pkunky who only exist in that they had something to say during the debriefing after the mock battles.

It's back!  ;D

I should have commented on this the first time, but somehow missed doing so, and then I thought it wasn't going to get any more updates so I didn't want to necro it. But you did update it after all.

And good thing too, because this fic is awesome.

P.S. The battle sims remind me of when I save on the Encounter screen in case I lose. I thought that was pretty cool.

I have radically revised part 13. There were, I realized, interesting things to show rather than just skipping over. Then I cut it off at the obvious stopping-point.

The trimmed material will go in section 14, when it comes out; it will similarly be expanded upon.

I have realized that I erred in part 2, and the cut part of part 13, in that I forgot that Zelnick and crew would know that there are no more Androsynth, only Orz, due to IDF experimentation, via the Arilou.


Here is the cast list. Numbers in brackets indicate the part(s) they appear in or are referred to by name; with tilde, referred to not by name.

the crew of the 1038, including all the characters I haven't mentioned. A blanket rundown of the ship's roster without names was given in part 1.
Faazur (M), captain (up to partway through part 1)
Peeru (F), captain [all parts]
Muugko (M), lieutenant [1-13]
Trifop (M), communications (watchholder) [3, 12-14]
Feres (F), navigation (watchholder) [1, 7, ~9, 12-14]
Genlo (M), gunner [~10, 11 - 14]
Kaandor (F), chief engineer [4, 10 - 13]
Heeran (F), engineer [12, 13]
Wugyup (M), technician (until part 7) [3, 7-10, 12-14]
Nuun (F), technician specializing in cannon maintenance [12, 14]
Guuni (M), technician specializing in propulsion system
Maaruk (F), technician specializing in power system
Vaando (M), technician specializing in food service [12, 13]
Faanso (F), trainee
Nabek (F), trainee [3, 7, 12]
Martin Ndeki (M, human), engineer specializing in aiien technology (starting part 10) [10, 12, 13]

Characters back on Druuge homeworld, at the time of the beginning of the story:
Foomp (M) Peeru's boss, director of offworld trade [1, 2, 7, 9]
Kahso (M) Peeru's ex-fiance-analog, presently assistant director of acquisitions [1]
Ganjak (M), aka Goonac. Heeran's father [11, 12]

Captains of the Fleet as it existed at the inception of the story:
Zelnick, the Captain [1-3, 5-15]
Fwiffo (M Spathi) [5, 11, 14]
Wu (M human) [2, 3, 9, 13] Peeru's first trainer, captain of the green team.
Abrams (M human) [5]
PorKoo ( = Porm & Koos, M Pik and F Zoq, respectively; and ', Fot ), captain of the gray team [4-8, 13]
Jay (M Pkunk) [4, 5, 8, 9, 11-13]
Snelopy (? Spathi) [4, 5, ~6]
Pkunky (? Spathi) [5, ~6] (  <-- should I change this one?  )
Tifiwilo (? Arilou) [4, ~5-6]
Tinkafo (? Arilou) [5, 6, 10] Peeru's second trainer
Wewalia (? Arilou) [~5-6]

Other characters:
Fenson (M) Zelnick's attache [2, 7]
Raman (F) unspecified rating [7]
Tippy (M Pkunk) programmer, unknown rank [10-13]
Simpson (M) programmer, unknown rank [10]
Hayt (M) programmer, unknown rank [10]
Bihouta (F) ensign [12]
Ian Fesch (M), petty officer second grade, drill gaffer, dorsal lander checker [14]
Bridget (F), Danny's girlfriend [15]
Danny (M), Bridget's boyfriend [15]
Rydra (F), head Syreen captain [15]
Trixia (F), Syreen captain [15]
Kay (F), Syreen captain [15]

Please do. Also don't bring in a VUX captain named "ORZ". There's a few other names on the captain list like that.

By the way, "Koos" is how we say "pussy" (the slang term) here in Israel. I misread "Porm" as "Porn" at first.

That was a moment of trivia. Carry on.

Porn and Koos: Well, that's interesting. Not going to do anything about it, though.

I don't have any plans for named VUX captains aside from Zex, so we should be safe on the Orz front.

Unfortunately, due to a board feature, I can't change anything in the old batch. Should I repost the entire thing with the changes? Or could a moderator somehow refresh or authorize editing the old posts, or something along those lines?

I apologize for the large delay. I had been kind of stuck on several aspects of the last scene in part 15, but then just this afternoon I realized how to make it work naturally. And so in it went, and there we go.

Part 16 is very complicated, so it may take a little while for me to get it in, but it shouldn't be anything like the several months between 14 and 15.

Also, points for catching the references for the three new captain names.

Feeling a bit indifferent to this chapter, though I can see it was primarily a transition.


That's clunky. Please flesh this part out more.

Oops. Yeah, I reordered the scene and fixed up only the other three splice points. Should be smoother now.

Updated cast list.

Parts 16-18 added. They start on page 2 of the thread, so you don't need to wade through the first  80% of the book.

I have been sitting on these for a while, but was stymied in an effort to retcon in the text due to some rule about not changing board history. Stupid temporal paradoxes.

And I didn't make a new thread because I forgot I could get the old BBCode by replying. But then when I remembered I could do that, I said screw it, I'll put it in the original thread. And there we go.

I have another partially completed section. I will put it up when finished.

In case you are not aware, Peeru had been continued on the SCDB (http://www.star-control.com/community/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=106) for some time, reaching chapter 36 just today. It fell into inactivity as my 'real life' took its toll, but I expect a resumption of semimonthly updates.

This is a very good read! I just have one question, though. What does a female Druuge look and sound like?

To untrained eyes and ears, within individual variation of a male one. A careful reading would reveal that no non-Druuge even attempts to guess the gender of an unfamiliar Druuge, and Zelnick at first mistakes Peeru for the (male) Faazur.

Druuge can tell the difference at a glance.
Females tend to have weaker legs than males, and stronger arms. In particular, their toes and knee-flaps are longer and better at manipulating small things, but not as strong at sheer grasping. Females were not frequent long distance travelers over the time-frame of the species' evolution, and did their work in comparatively friendly environments, so they do not have as many adaptations as males for dealing with awkward climbing situations.
Females' horns are more narrowly set but slightly longer (horns only begin to be prominent at maturity, when gender has been fixed)
Females not carrying young will have a smaller belly. Of course, with young, it will be substantially larger.
Females will have smaller cheeks.

The two less visible but more important differences are the simple sperm/egg dichotomy and that males' pouches are heavily optimized for safely transferring and rapidly feeding a growing egg, while the females' are more broadly optimized for keeping it safe from bumps and collisions, falling out, infection, temperature variations, etc.

That makes sense, but you still haven't answered the second part of my question. What does a female Druuge voice sound like?

Let me think it through. I don't know of any evolutionary force that would encourage a differentiation in voice - high-low, for instance, doesn't seem needed - though I can't do the same for humans either, so that's a wash. There could be consequences of their differing psychologies, to the extent that that's reliable. Certainly I've written the non-Peeru females with relatively simple speech. Direct, to the point. A point was made that she was made to study language and is good at it, so she's exempt from that. But that's not the same thing as sound and tone.

Then there's the question of whether I take the druuge voice-acting to be canonical. I'm not familiar with it, really.

Simply to make them more alien, I'd go with the females sounding much like the males, differing only in style or manner - tentatively speaking.

I finally got to reading this story, and I must say that I was pleasantly surprised. I do not have very high expectations of fan fiction in general (though I have not read much), but this was well written and original.

I particularly liked the description of the Druuge culture. I considered them as inherently ruthless, opportunistic and selfish, but you have shown that does not so much have to be in their genetics, but that it could be a consequence of their culture.
I can see how their behaviour could be a result of having strict procedures (so individuals will blindly follow them without regard for the bigger picture) and a system which rewards profitable behaviour no matter what.
And I can imagine how such a system could have come into being, with new rules and procedures added for every gap discovered in the old set as people start abusing those rules.

I also read through this a week or so ago... it's very good, though I think I recall some little annoying things such as sometimes not being able to figure out who's saying something.

First, note that there is a lot more of this at the SCDB (I guess my note at the end of what's here made that obvious).

Second, CelticMinstrel, can you point out where that occurs? I guess any long alternating passages would be candidates for this to set in, but it'd help if you'd point me in the right direction.

Third, Meep-eep, it's not entirely cultural, but yes, that's one thing I was aiming for. I mean, consider the Stanford Prison Experiment. Those are humans.

I'd have to read through it again, I think, or at least scan all the chapters. Perhaps I'll find some time to do that in a week or so.

Note that in general, simple alternating passages (with two speakers), while part of the problem, aren't the main issue; it's when you introduce a third person that it becomes confusing. I forget whether this applies to your fanfic in particular.

It could. I'll do the looking, then. Don't worry.

Eh, I'll still re-read it sometime and let you know if I find anything else. :)