The Ur-Quan Masters Discussion Forum

The Ur-Quan Masters Re-Release => General UQM Discussion => Topic started by: Shiver on March 21, 2008, 03:49:47 am



Title: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 21, 2008, 03:49:47 am
Hi guys! I'm hosting another net melee tournament. The turn-out for these things is usually disappointing but I'm going to give this another spin. If you're thinking about attending, speak up in this topic.


-----[Date]

Saturday, March 29th, 2008


-----[Time]

    * 5 AM Sydney
    * 7 AM Otaki
    * 12 PM Los Angeles / US Pacific Time
    * 1 PM Denver / US Mountain Time
    * 2 PM Chicago / US Central Time
    * 3 PM New York / US Eastern Time
    * 7 PM London
    * 8 PM Paris
    * 9 PM Helsinki


-----[Place]

#UQM-Arena on irc://chat.freenode.net.


-----[Tournament Structure]

All players regardless of net melee skill will compete against each other. However, paticularly gifted players will use smaller fleets and the very best will be severely handicapped. We are using Swiss tournament rules. If you lose a round, you are not ejected from the tournament but instead play against the other beaten players. There will be three rounds, then possibly a final bout between the two top participants if a clear winner has not emerged.


-----[Tournament Rules]

1) There is a maximum fleet size of 200 points. Talented players will be restricted to 150 point fleets. Top tier players must use 100 point fleets.
2) Only one of each ship type is allowed in a fleet.
3) You must have your team set up before connecting to another player for melee. Do not adjust your fleet once you've connected to an opponent.
4) All players with handicapped scores may not have a Thraddash Torch in their fleet.
5) Foul play will result in you being ejected from the tournament. This hasn't ever happened before, and hopefully it never will.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Captain Mazda on March 21, 2008, 08:03:49 am
This sounds great. Hopefully I won't be busy during the New York server time.

Count me in, mate :)


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Lurker on March 21, 2008, 10:29:10 am
*emerges*

Did someone say... tournament?

You know I'm in. Let's just hope my internet connection allows it, though.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Amiga_Nut on March 21, 2008, 10:52:17 pm
Well I'd enjoy playing. However, I remember being banned because I refused to comply with the no Thraddash rule and tended to play long matches when facing a better player. I’m really not interested in debating the finer nuances of evasion tactics when playing a mutant player who is mostly used to running down and totally murdering the opposition. IE: "boring matches" vs. "time limit" -Did you mention a time limit? Or is that determination still arbitrary? IE: "foul play"
Is my ranking to be re-evaluated by some kind of grand potentate before I am included in the handicapped group? -Or am I still.. just plain banned?   ???>:(


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 22, 2008, 01:47:56 am
Amiga Nut:

I have you marked down as a 150 point player right now. Whether you're willing to play without Thraddash or skip out is your call, but keep in mind that all of those "mutant players" are going to be playing with 100 point fleets and should not be all that difficult to beat this time around.

There is no time limit. If there's any crap going on like a player using a Pkunk to perpetually run away from their opponent, pause the game and tell me about it. That sort of thing is what makes a match go longer than 30 minutes.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Amiga_Nut on March 22, 2008, 03:00:53 am
I disagree with the exclusion of the Thraddash for 150 point players, and suggest that limitation be imposed on only the top tier players. I however yield to your tournament rules under protest.  I’m in.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Tiberian on March 22, 2008, 09:21:45 am
Looks like I'll get to see how rusty I have become.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Gekko on March 22, 2008, 01:05:59 pm
Ooh, it'll be lots of fun! And time seems fine too.

I am in.

Question about the tournament: How do you select the opponents? Are we allowed to change our fleets between battles? Do you trust people don't go arsing around about their scores, both claiming they've won (I quess this won't be a problem as I've played against only friendly people before)?


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Amiga_Nut on March 22, 2008, 01:20:43 pm
I have actually had a similar problem before. I would suggest that you print the screen after the battle to show the score and make sure your team name reflects your irc handle. You can show the picture to the tournament leader if a problem arises. Yes, I believe you can change your team between battles. 
 


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 22, 2008, 03:03:49 pm
Question about the tournament: How do you select the opponents? Are we allowed to change our fleets between battles? Do you trust people don't go arsing around about their scores, both claiming they've won (I quess this won't be a problem as I've played against only friendly people before)?

I select pairs on the first round by assigning numbers to all the players and using a random number generator to decide who plays against who. If there are an odd number of players then someone will sit out each round. Odd man out counts as a win. In subsequent rounds, players with the same number of wins and losses will go up against each other.

You may change fleets between rounds.

None of the regulars have ever bullshitted with their tournament results and I don't expect that to be a problem. If this situation pops up, I'm going to side with whoever appears more credible. Record your game with Fraps if you need insurance. A screenshot of the final score tally is something that can be photoshopped, but if you can host it somewhere within moments of a dispute beginning I'll assume it's real.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Cedric6014 on March 23, 2008, 09:15:37 pm
Awesome - maybe i'll get off my ass and fix my connection so I can play. 7am though - ugh

Good on you for resusitating these. Looks like we may have a new set of players hopefully


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Gekko on March 24, 2008, 07:01:11 pm
One problem popped in my mind:

How are we going to deal with lag issues? I've had problems with some of the regular #uqm-arena visitors as they don't have fast enough bandwith or live too far from Finland. Not all of us are americans...


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Cedric6014 on March 24, 2008, 08:12:15 pm
No, in fact most of you are Finns. Not all of us are Finns you know...


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 25, 2008, 12:27:52 am
I'll test people's connection before we get started. My experience has been that location usually doesn't matter.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Waylander on March 26, 2008, 01:54:50 pm
I would so love to be in but  3 Am is a little extreme for me.

Coincidently I just posted about how unbalanced the Torches are for their cost


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Saros on March 26, 2008, 06:53:36 pm
I'm new to this forum, yet I'd like to participate.

Of course, I wouldn't mind a little training before that. Also some other questions:

How can I play online Melee with another player? What programs/requirements/information will I need? I have downloaded the UQM version 0.6.2, do I need something else? Thanx in advance.



Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 26, 2008, 09:54:41 pm
I'm new to this forum, yet I'd like to participate.

Of course, I wouldn't mind a little training before that. Also some other questions:

How can I play online Melee with another player? What programs/requirements/information will I need? I have downloaded the UQM version 0.6.2, do I need something else? Thanx in advance.

If you can get into the IRC chatroom at some point (server and room listed in the first post), there's usually a few people idling that can be persuaded to play you if you nag them enough. If you don't know how to netplay, they'll show you. Expect a beatdown; most of those guys are really good.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Lurker on March 29, 2008, 09:13:21 pm
I knew I forgot something... Sorry about not being there, after all...


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 29, 2008, 10:15:59 pm
Tournament Synopsis: Those 100 point fleets suck hard. I don't think we'll be playing with severe handicaps again any time soon. There were a lot of upset victories because of this.


[ROUND 1]

Amiga Nut (150) defeats Gnomp (150) by 60.

Saros (150) defeats Shiver (100) by 38.

Elvish Pillager (100) defeats Gekku (150) by 17.

Tiberian (100) defeats Megagun (200) by 28.


[ROUND 2]

Saros (150) defeats Elvish Pillager (100) by 29.

Amiga Nut (150) defeats Tiberian (100) by 75.

Gekku (150) defeats Megagun (200) by 15.

Gnomp (150) defeats Shiver (100) by 32.


[ROUND 3]

Saros (150) defeats Amiga Nut (150) by 13. Saros is the champion of the March Melee Tournament.

Tiberian (100) defeats Elvish Pillager (100) by 18. Upset! #1 seeded player loses on an even playing field!

Gekku (150) defeats Gnomp (150) by 43.

Megagun leaves early, Shiver sits out.


[BONUS ROUND]

Saros (200) loses to Elvish Pillager (200) by 100 points. I wanted to see how good the champion really was so I set this up just for kicks.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Saros on March 29, 2008, 10:20:17 pm
I need much more practice. One suggestion, though. MB the fleet differences shouldn't be that great. 50 points a difference is too much. What about 30?


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Elvish Pillager on March 29, 2008, 10:26:17 pm
Tiberian defeating me by a little is not an upset - I've always been very hard pressed to win against him.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Death 999 on March 30, 2008, 04:44:44 pm
I'd find it interesting if fleets used, and perhaps the order of ships taken, were recorded. A little late for this time, but...

I expect some people at least would have the fleets they used still recorded, in game data if nothing else.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Elvish Pillager on March 30, 2008, 10:44:54 pm
For the record, I used:
Utwig, Mmrnmhrm, Slylandro, Druuge, Androsynth, Ilwrath

...and I don't think it was optimal.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on March 30, 2008, 11:03:25 pm
Here's my old fleet:


(http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb278/SunBloom/X_Fleet.gif)


This was not an optimal setup and it wasn't supposed to be. Most of the player base does not know how to counter an intelligently played Kohr-Ah effectively. To a lesser extent, the same applies to Chmmr. Those two ships supported by a few smaller things would have done me more good. I was expecting Elvish Pillager or Tiberian to abuse both capships against the less experienced players, but from the sound of it none of us actually did.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Gekko on March 31, 2008, 09:12:28 am
It was really fun to play for ONCE against someone else than Shiver. However, I did not quite like the rule system. I thought that we were all going to play against everyone and then count the scores we got. That is the system we used in our chess tournaments a few years ago. The problem with the system we used was that someone might be against the best player in the first round and lose to him. As he has lost his first game, he can't win anymore.

With the other system, people can continue trying to make their way to 1st place even if they lose. Or did I understand the system wrong? I only played 3 games and there were 8 people.

EDIT: Damn Elvish, you had 1 crew left ;_; good game, anyway.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Cedric6014 on March 31, 2008, 10:58:21 am
Unfortunately Gekko, when there are 8 players and only 3 or4 rounds, you can't expect a second life.

The Swiss system is the best way of keeping the maximum amount of participants involved in competition in one short session.

Otherwise you have to do it over several sessions - you cant really expect to play the other 7 folks on one day - that's too much melee.

Another option is to run a league over several consecutive Saturdays (playing 3 or so games each time). We've done this before and we'll probably do it again. This does require a degree of commitment from participants though.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: AngusThermopyle on March 31, 2008, 05:16:07 pm
Yeah, unfortunately, I couldn't make this.

But the results are interesting in so far as the handicapping goes. Only once did a player with a point advantage 'cover the spread'. This does suggest that perhaps the handicap should be reduced (say by 30, as Saros suggested).

Perhaps 200, 170, and 140 for beginners to experts, respectively?


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Death 999 on March 31, 2008, 06:57:39 pm
I was expecting Elvish Pillager or Tiberian to abuse both capships against the less experienced players, but from the sound of it none of us actually did.

Avoiding all eggs being in one basket? Having both would take up over half their team right there.


Title: Re: March Melee Tournament
Post by: Shiver on April 01, 2008, 12:02:07 am
I was expecting Elvish Pillager or Tiberian to abuse both capships against the less experienced players, but from the sound of it none of us actually did.

Avoiding all eggs being in one basket? Having both would take up over half their team right there.

Yeah, exactly. I said most players don't know how to deal with those ships. It doesn't matter if all the eggs are in one basket of those eggs are made of titanium and the basket is actually an air-tight capsule that has been welded shut. If I were to play a 100 point fleet with Kohr-ah + Chmmr against a top tier player, that would a be a different story.