The Ur-Quan Masters Discussion Forum

Serioulsy, the Shofixti are the most dangerous creatures in the Sc2 universe! Think about it:

After a very short time, there are suddenly enough Shofixti to crew your ships and push crew costs down. In other words, their birth rate most be extremly high (Seiing as they start off with just 5 females), and the time between birth and maturity cannot be all too long either, for them to be able to serve aboard starships the quickly. This of course is a good thing, seeing as it allows you to crew your ships more cheaply, and start a certain war...

But what about the long range consequences? It shouldn't take very long for the Shofixti to rebuild their sphere of influence with that birthrate, and the Yehat (fools that they are) if not the Alliance itself will probably be more than happy to provide them with machinery and equipment until such a time that they are once more able to construct their own. So the Sphere will be rebuilt rather qucikly. and then, due to population pressures, it will expand to new starsystems. this will continue until both humans and Yehat (Possibly vux and Orz as well have a border towards the Shofixti. At this time, the Shofixit, honourable as they are will have only one choice : To send out colonisation ships to other unclaimed parts of space. Soon, the other spacefaring races in our quadrant will be like liferafts, bobbing around in a seething sea of Shofixti.

Sooner or later, either the other races wil begin to feel their own population pressure, and try to expand into Shofixti territory, or the Shofixti, honourable though they may be, will be forced to annex our space! This is a most grave threat.

Any thoughts on this, howe it can be avoided, or why it wont happen?

A) the birthrate was probably exaggerated in order to make the game playable.

B) Spaceships cannot carry planetary size populations. The Syreen were cut from billions down to a couple 100,000 when they tried it.
Therefore, shofixti population pressures cannot be relieved by colonial expansion.
Therefore, shofixti population pressures will be resolved by some other means.

They are quite dangerous - but only against those whom they choose to fight.

A) Perhaps, but we're told the Shofixti do really mature rather quickly. And I don't mean they'd do this in a year, I'm talking about the coming three centuries or so. Look how much the human population has grown in that time, and remember the shofxti reproduce MUCh more quickly, even if the game part was exaggerated.

B) The Syreen didn't have a ready spacefleet, and no time to build anything much since they had no time. their planet was blowing up. I'm talking about a controlled expansion where you send out large colony ships. While these in their own don't slow the growthrate, they do remove some of the excess population (it all depends on when you start using them), and can keep things closer to status quo. Besides, if your world's ecosystem is about to crash and take your race with you, you'd want to send off colony ships to preserve the race. Maybe they'd function like locusts, spreading in an outward circle cannibalising planets, and then going on to the next ones...

Well, Given that the gestation rate is highly accelerated.  One might also assume that the mortality rate is also greatly accelerated as well.  This is disproven by both Tanaka and the female Shofixti that Admiral Zex has in his custody.

Also, with the advent of the Yehat, their feudal society has been advanced at an abnormal rate, relieving them of a majority of internal conflict between warlords and houses.  The question then is, what kept the population down in the first place.  We hear no mention of a population problem on their homeworld during the first war, nor do we hear problems with there being an overt amount of Shofixti in any other region of space.  This could be largely due to the fact that they were incapable of starflight before the Yehat arrived.

So what was it? Natural predators?  Mass suicide? -And, if so, why mass suicide before the war started?  They could, through the process of evolution have been restricted to methods of population control simply for this reason.

It is reasonable to think that as honorable as they are, they would find a way to take care of the problem, or would accept aid from other races in how to better handle the situation without taking over the whole or even a quarter of the known galaxy.  Perhapse some genetic manipulation?

Arcain.

Well, seriously - I remember the article in the star trek technical manual where one of the directors mentioned a question by a writer: "how long would it take the Enterprise to evacuate a planet?"
Answer: 5 million years, assuming that they didn't reproduce.
Now, considering that just to relieve the marginal increase in population of 40 - 90 billion (assuming a full planet of critters much smaller than humans) would take moving about 4 billion people a year... say we use the precursor tech, stringing a large number of crew compartments together and slapping an engine on the side. 100 shofixti per crew compartment @ 2000 RUs each. Then throw in the fuel consumption , around 15 per round trip to a nearby star - multiply that by 20 and you get 300 per about 1600 shofixti moved (assuming that fuel efficiency is not too much better than on the precursor tug).
A short trip like this will take about a week, so we only have to move a 50th of the 4 billion new shofixti every trip.
startup costs: 4 billion shofixti per year / 50 trips per year / 100 shofixti per compartment * 2000 RUs per compartment  = 1.6 billion RUs to build the fleet
fuel cost: 4 billion shofixti / 1600 shofixti per ship per trip * 300 RUs per ship per trip = 750 million RUs per year

I think that this kind of volume would stress even the Chmmr "infinite" RU capacity.

SO, the answer will probably be some form of birth control. Abstinence, timing, chemical, implant, barrier, soylent green... whatever it is, it will be used.

Marsupials on Earth have a large birth rate, but do not overpopulate the planet.  That's because there are predators to control numbers.  The Shofixti are a war-like, honourable people and they may battle amongst themselves, lowering the numbers.  Besides, they're not animals and don't breed like there's no tommorrow.  Most sentient races control their numbers because of this fact, like humans.

Besides, the Shoftixti population is growing faster than their technology.  They pose little threat to space because they aren't building ships as fast as they're shackin' up.

Given the short gestation and maturation time of the Shofixti you will have thousands of the creatures in ten years, and millions in twenty. -Melnorme Captain

I'd say the Melnorme know what they're talking about with xenobiology.  One odd point, notice how he refers to them as creatures instead of just saying "them" or "the aliens."

What I thought more interesting is where do the Shofixti live after SC2?  Delta Gorno can't support the civilization it once did...

Perhaps not as it stands now. Maybe someone will find a precursor terraforming tool, maybe something similar to Genesis from that one Star Trek movie?

Perhaps the Mycon could be... persuaded to engineer some offspring whose purpose is to restore life to planets rather than to render them nigh lifeless?

Maybe in the meantime they can live on Organon. Who knows? There's a universe of possibilities out there. =)

I'm surprised there were any planets left around the sun in Delta Gorno.. Theoretically they'd be pushed away and break out of orbit, if they survive the blast as a whole.

Perhaps the Shofixti have laws against having tons and tons of kids (like they do in China). Just because they're capable of reproducing like rabbits doesn't mean that do.

In feudal times, Shofixti probably killed each other by the thousands on a regular basis. Now they must have birth control and breeding laws, as mentioned earlier. When the war with the Ur-Quan took place, maybe they loosened those restrictions a bit to give the Alliance infinite crew replacements.

In any case, the Shofixti are probably aware of the danger they can pose to the rest of the universe. If the Shofixti ever tried to over-run the galaxy with their numbers and kill everything off Kohr-Ah style (they wouldn't do this, I'm just saying), every other species would wipe them out immediately.  Also, the Shofixti aren't the type to think up new technology very fast (if at all, seeing as how they got theirs from the Yehat).

Remember, the Yehat found the Shofixt when they were still living in crude mud huts.  I think there's reason to believe that the Shofixti still kill eachother in ritual combat fairly often.

Well, i certainly never expected this many replies to a topic I came up with just to have something to discuss :)

A point to consider in this is the Shofixti sphere of influence. If I remember my history correctly the Shofixti hadf been elevetated to space-faring status only  20 years before the war began. And yet, their sphere of influence includes five stars, and is almost the size of the human sphere. Clearly the Shofixti were expanding in they years they had starflight, and quite well. If the war hadn't come along, who knows how far they would have come by now?

Also, on their home planet they were a primitive people. While they were the most intelligent species of their world, It does not mean that they at this stage of evolution were dominant. Their samll bvears, dangerous but nothing like for example, a panther or a polar bear. and we don't know what they had on their planet... There were probably other predators around, fearsome enough to keep the Shofixtis numbers down. Maybe that's why they had to mature so quickly in the first place, because only a few of them would normally reach adulthood. But give them technology to protect themselves and spread, and suddenly all their threats have been eliminated, but their reproductive cycle is uinchanged. their numbers will gorw quite a lot then.

I agree with Death_999 on the impossibility to evacuate an entire planet, I still think the Shofixti would feel it necessary to spread further. When population pressure becomes too great ppl want to move, regardless of if that solves the original problem or not. In the long run, emigratimg to america didn't solve anything either, but it sure helped at the time. The Shofixti could get rid of excess population in the form of opposition, practioners of other religions and so on the same way. even if a shofixti world has a way of controlling it's piopulation when it reaches a critical number, there are a lot of ppl who wont like thisd (as in China I expect) and who will rather emigrate and have large familiees, than stay and have one offspring.

Oh, and if the shofixti kill eachother in ritual combat in the numbers ppl seem to assume here, and fairly often, due to issues of honour and such, it'd give them another reason to emigrate even quicker. Most of their worlds would be taken up by graveyards, and honourable as they are, they could not desecrate them simply to gain more living space.

Shofixti are not human, and therefore do not necessarily bury their dead at all. I would say they don't because it would be impossible for their species to survive on their homeworld because the whole place would turn into a big graveyard in a century or so. I don't think there were any predators on the Shofixti homeworld that endangered the Shofixti's existance because of the Shofixti's attitude towards death. If they had to deal with predators to survive, even after they had begun building cities and wielding weapons, they would not be so careless with their own lives because they would have evolved to be more afraid of danger. The Spathi had the Evil Ones invade their world, and as a result the Spathi that survived the onslaught and escaped to the moon were overly paranoid of anything threatening. Shofixti die for whatever cause without a second thought because it's actually better for their fast-breeding species that most of them don't get to have offspring. Their homeworld can only have so many resources that it is necessary that they kill each other off frequently. The only (semi) proof I have to back up all of what I just said is that the kamikaze ships they use and the whole "Blow Up Our Own Sun So We Don't Have To Lose Face" incident demonstrate how cheaply they value their own lives.

Does any of what I just said make sense?

Shofixti are not human, and do not necessarily bury their dead at all, this is true. But something ahs to be done with their bodies, and seeing as these traditions probably evolved before they yehat uplifted them, that means they'd either have to burn them, or use mass graves, or some such. Either way, it would use up a lot of resources (you can't just make a pile of corpses disappear after all). the only way out of this I can see is if they started jettisoning corpses into space after becoming uplifted. however, wouldn't this make their systmes a bit hard to navigate through? Loads of potential impacts everywhere, and while a Shofixti doesn't have the same effect as a meteorite, a nunch of them might....

Also, I have to say I disagree with you on the way they value life. I think it's quite unfair to say that they deem life worthless. It is simply that they recognise that some causes are more important than life. Compare to Japanese suicide planes during WWII... they were ready to give their life for their country, for honour, for the future. But that doesn't mean that they valued life so little, that while off duty they'd just cut someones throat or step infront of a bus. They just valued some things more than life.

Also the Spathi have a culture of selfpreservation, like us, but taken to an extreme. the spathi's main interest isthe survival of the individual. Only in extreme circumstances can they make a stand together as a race, and accept that death will come for them. The Shofixti howerver, put principles over selfpreservation. They are willing to die for what they believe in.

Also, the fact that you have to deal with dangerous predators to survive would actually put you further towards the Shofixti frame of mind if you start out as a group that has some fundamental principle of honour. It'd be like the Glory Device on a smaller scale. Sometimes an individual would have to give up his life to save the group (by say, throwing himself in front of a slavering monster to give the others time to retreat and regroup), but his life would not mean less to him for that.

A culture that values life cheaply wouldn't build glory devices, they'd build Maulers, where you sacrifice crew when you want to.

The shofixtis will be like the tribbles in no time at all!  Next thing you know, they'll infest the halls of the New Alliance's ships and we won't be able to control their furry madness!

Reminds me of the DS9 episode where Sisko goes back in time to find the tribble with the bomb inside of it.  Hehe.

O'Brien: "THAT's a Klingon?!"
Bashir:  "Worf...?  *stares*  What happened?  Mass genetic mutation...?  Evolution?"
Worf: "My people...  prefer not to talk about it."

Hehe, that episode always cracks me up!

I thought in the game (or the outtakes, memory failure) it was told, that the Shofixti went to the Yehat and lived there as well, until they find a new place to live. That makes a pretty full planet: Yehat, Pkunk (rearrived), Shofixti (visiting friends).
Maybe in SC3v2 we could suggest the Spathi to go there as well, because the Yehat have friends all the time anyway, and the Pkunk do not mind sitting cramped, and the Shifixti would be an aid in protecting the Spathi as well as the Tarminator and the Fury.

I'd just love to see a Spathi sitting in a digged hole, because the flying predators (Yehat) make the use of a tree with a basket full of nice colored and well shaped, not too small nor too big stones quite useless. And the groundwalking predators (Shofixti) make the ground as dangerous.

CYa,
Martin

Although I have to admit, that for ap erson whose never watched Star Trek, the fun part of it kinda passes me by.. :)

How are the Starfaring clans of the Yehat arranged anyway? I mean, there is only one home planet, but one would assume that the central planets of each clan are quite large as well... How many clans are there anyway?

Okay, let's say that the planets around Delta Gorno break out of orbit by the force of the blast. Can someone estimate how much time would it take for them to clear the system?
Less or more than 20 years?



Cannibalism, perhaps? That'd lessen the strain the Shofixti would cause to an ecosystem.

blah blah blah? I can't seem to recall ever saying that :)

Cannibalism is a very good idea, it would lessen the srain on the ecosystem a lot. Although I have to wonder, is the glory device at all compatible with that way of life? I mean, assuming they have some sort of ritual cannibalism to pass on the spirits of their elders or some such, blowing oneself into smithereens in the cold void of space seems to be rather in conflict with the rest of their culture...

it all depends... did the sun become a hot nebula? Looks like it didn't. That would have meant the planets would have a continuous drag and lose orbital momentum and fall into the sun.
A simple shove won't make a planet escape or fall into the sun - it WOULD make the orbits more eccentric and generally change the shape of the solar system, but those planets are still captured by the gravity of the star.

Now, supernovae can kick a planet hard enough to eject (we calculate, never having seen it), but this seems to not have been a supernova. After all, it was artificial...

Does the game ever mention how Tanaka/Katana survives the explosion?  I don't really remember.

When looking at the starmap packaged with the original Star Control II PC game, I look at Yehat space and see how big it was before the VUX and Mycon became a threat when the Kzer-Za show up.  It shows you just how strong the Meep-eep royal family, or whatever it is, really was.  Not to mention the Terminator's a sweet ship, so it made expansion fairly easy, I guess.  Of all the original Alliance races, the Yehat's sphere of influence was the largest.

One other thing.  I've always wondered about the discrepencies of Yehat space in Star Control I and II.  In SC, the manual says that the Yehat come from a nebula where space is different, and that's the origins of their strange shield technology.  It's weird that Paul and Fred seemingly scrapped this idea for the second game... there's no mention of their species coming from this strange nebula in space, or any place of the sort.  Wondering if anyone else picked that up...

Yeah, Tanaka was on deep patrol when they eploded the sun.

He'd fought a VUX and gotten limpeted, so he came home too slowly to get blown up (lucky him)

Nebulas would have been sweet... But it would cease to be SC.

I think a plausible method of disposing of that many dead would be a burial-at-sea kind of idea.  It never says if they lived near oceans or rivers, but mud huts does imply access to water.  And by placing their dead in the ocean/river, it gets them out of the way of the living Shofixti, in addition its eaten quickly and continues the cycle.

Now, if you picture the idea of burial in space...  It wouldn't be a big problem.  There's really no chance of hitting anything in space, especially if they are vaporized themselves with a glory device, or eject pods into the atmosphere of a planet where they're disintegrated upon re-entry (ala the Mirak in Star Trek).  Seem plausible to anybody else?

Maybe Delta Gorno just needs a visit from Trojan Man.

Seems plausible to me. I'm just saying, that if their growth rate is really as amazing as the Melnorme make out, they wont be able to continue those tradtions, unless there are some serious fish around there who eat nothing but Shofixti. The point I was trying to make was that no matter, how they took care of their dead in earlier times, they're gonna have to find a new way to do it now that they are masters of their natural habitats. Their growth rate just forces them to colonize, and thus they are a threat...

No real threat though - they all wear red uniform-shirts and volunteer to all dangerous landing parties & fighting encounters  :D

Hmm I guess they ARE somewhat too short to wear white armor and aim blasters badly... :p

Very good point! There ARE people a little too short for a stormtrooper...

How they keep their population down is they blow themselves up. see they never thought of swords and guns untill the yehat came along all they did in battle is run in with large barrels of black poweder on their back. once they were in range they would detinate it. :D

Well, against such an army all you have to do is disperse your troops and their tactic will be ineffective. You need to have swords so that when your enemy is dispersed you can send in small squads that will locally outnumber the dispersed enemy.

This is why the pea shooter exists. It's not ALL glory device.

I'd prefer my trusty old potato gun  8)

(To be honest, I never built one, because building stuff makes me hungry and I was always out of potatoes before the planning was through)

I'm afraid I'm a bit more alcohol orienterd, so my weapn of choice is a Molotov coctail! Shaken, not stirred.

Dammit, LP! You always have to lead every thread to alcohol, don't you? I tried sooo hard NOT to do that  :D

I better counter that by using up all ethanol I have right here before you come for a visit ;)

sorry, it's just in my nature I suppose. When I get a blood sample, they don't measure the percent of alcohol i nthe blood, they measure the percent of blood in the alcohol. :)

Seriously speaking though, seeing as my people invented the Molotov coctail I felt I needed to mention it among noble food weapons.

That's new to me! I always thought that the Molotow-Cocktail was naimed after Stalin's foreign Minister Molotow who's name served for the handmade gasoline-bombs used against Deutsche Panzer.

Getting off-topic again, but here (http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov_cocktail)'s a link on the subject.

Well, you've got all the details right, except for one. Those homemade bombs were made by the finns, and used against SOVIET tanks when they invaded Finland during the Winter War.

For some reason, the russians really want the name for themselves nowadays, and they've even released an actual alcohol called Molotov Coctail. On the bottle of that, it's stated that it was developed during the great war of freedom against enemy tanks, and that is even what some history booksiover there say. The Soviet propaganda machine runs strong still. But it was in fact, out way of paying Molotov back for the ultimatums he made against our country.

My apologies to you, LP and to the Finns - the copyright is all yours!
My apologies to you, Novus, for getting off topic - I really shouldn't do that all the time...

As for the real topic - I don't know what else to say about it. If something else comes to my mind - I'll be back  :D

Man, the Finnish make everything; saunas, linux, ssh, better cellphones, and home-made explosive bottles!   ;D

Say, LP, what are you guys really most famous for?

Finland is the home of Nokia, one of the richest companies in the world (I think it's around 7th or something).  Basically, that's all I know the country for... hehe.   8)

Canadians invented basketball, the telephone and even Superman!  No one can beat that.  Hehe, j/k of course.  But anyways, back to the shofixti... they're so loyal to the Alliance, as described in the SC1 and SC2 manuals, that they would die for their cause.  This extreme loyalty leads me to believe the Shofixti threat is only one directed towards the possible enemies of the New Alliance...

Solution to the Shofixti threat: feed them to the Orz. Just not all at once.

*Fuzzy campers* are all-time best for *marshmallow surprise*!

Well, who's gonna be quicker? The Orz curing their messed up stomach or the Shofixti rebuilding their population?

I bet that once the Orz are over their first really bad heartburn, the Shofixti will eventually win!

On a serious note regarding the discussion, I just want to point out two things that I didn't see raised-- apologies if I missed seeing them raised.

Now, it's already been pointed out that the Shofixti are sentient beings, not animals. Which means they have the ability to control their birth rate by methods not important, but nonetheless effective. The other piece that needs to be underlined, is the setting in which the game places the facts regarding Shofixti reproduction.

The Melnorme is no doubt accurate in his statements regarding the speed at which the species can re-populate. No argument there. Of course, he said that in the context of the game's current events: We have an outnumbered force going up against a much larger, better-armed, and more established  force. there's a reason it's referred to as the Ur-Quan Armada. So we have the Alliance, trying to build a fleet so they can take on not one, but *two* Ur-Quan armadas, which fly some of the best ships in space, plus all those battle thralls. And while the Kzer-ka and the Kor-ah are fighting it out, either one will gladly ignore the other to smack down an uppity race.

Thus, the Alliance, while gaining strength, is in one of the worst tactical positions imaginable. They're desperate, and one of their biggest needs is *manpower*. With more people, they can solve the lack of resources, ships, crew, etc. manpower is the key. But sources are limited. Under that circumstance, which I'm sure the Shofixti are fully aware of, they're going to breed as fast as their feet can carry them from bedroom to bedroom. We're not dealing with the species' natural reproductive rhythm. We're dealing with a maximium reproductive ability born out of extreme desparation. I think it's reasonable to assume that, back when they lived on their homeworld, with no greater need facing them as it does in the game, the population remains manageable.

As to the sphere of influence being as large as it is, the sphere doesn't represent the area of space in which the race in question lives-- it represents that area in which they exert influence. Which is partially controlled by the presence of colonies or whathaveyou, but more dependant on where you can expect to see their ships flying around. They don't have to live anywhere but the homeworld to have a sphere that size. They just have to be patrolling five systems out or whatever to exert that influence.I think it's reasonable to assume that however much planetary real estate the Shofixti commanded before they were all but annihilated, they maintained a defensive patrol line a fair ways outward from their physical territory. It's the smart thing to do, and that's what, realistically speaking, the spheres of influence represent. Not as important to the discussion as the first point, but a point I thought worth raising in reference to the statements made about their sphere being as large as it is.

There are also cultural and xenopsychological considerations and arguments one can make for the Shofixti not having population problems, but they've been pretty well covered already, and, I think, probably less of a determining factor than the first of my points. the second point, in a nutshell, is intended to lend weight to the idea that historically, the population of Delta Gorno wasn't a problem, so there's no reason there should be any in the future.

Kudos to Lukipela, by the way, for a nice observation that's spawned such an interesting and let's face it, largely thought-provoking discussion. It isn't easy.

Well observed, Azzizi!
Although sentient, the Shofixti are mammals after all (if I'm not mistaken) and there are many examples in Terra's wildlife for a maximum breeding capacity when a species is put under immense stress and/or threat. Rabbits for example can reproduce a lot faster when threatened by a lot of predators!
Thanks for that post - I think we missed that so far...

Back to reality eh? I'd like to point out that the question of birth rate control isn't as assured as you think. Look at us, we are a highly evolved technological civilization, and we still can't seem to do it. The shofixti are a more tribal society, who was uplifted, and thus haven't gone through the normal trial-and-error procedures that other spacefaring civilizations have. so while they may well be trying to control the birth rate of their species, it still remains and open question wether they are having any success with it.

The spehere of influence point is very good, the shofixti may not have lived anywhere else than on their homeworld, and had a presence in the other systems for strictly startegic and mining purposes. however, doesn't this already give an idea of poulation numbers? First off ,you need a fleet to patrol the systems and the hyperspace between them. Then, if you are a mining five systems, doesn't this indicate that there is a fair amount of building on consuming going on in the homesystem? To need that much raw material, there must be quite a few Shofixti using them. Rememebr, that when the Yehat arrived, they were living in "crude mudhuts" or some such, so they can't have mined their entire planet out in a few years, can they? Of course, it could be resource poor.

And also (restating myself yes, but it applies here), that hte population of Delta Gorno has not been a problem historically does not prove much. As a primitive species on their own world, the Shofixti could have fallen prey to larger predators, they can have had large famines in the past, or they could (and probably did) have had some massive wars, population control at it's finest.

Supporting this is the fact that, as GM reminds us, rabbits can reproduce in much larger numbers when they are threatened by many predators. If the Shofixti have the same ability, then surely they must have a evolved it due to similar conditions? So what happened before spaceflight doesn't really matter, the setting was completely different by then. The question is, what happens now that they are out of their natural habitat, without the factors that kept their numbers in check previously?

Again the rabbit example could prove helpful.

Not only do rabbits mate like crazy when they are threatened - they also do that when they are introduced to a very supporting new environment (like Australia).

The Shofixti - if the same biological phenomenon applies - could not only be reproduce like madmen when restricted to their own homesystem. Now the whole galaxy is their mating ground (and I bet they really like to as well just looking at Tanaka's comments).

As for us humans - we are the only animal (and mammal) to which non of the natural restrictions seem to apply... Sooner or later we will find out that the whole system (world) is gonna collapse because the ressources do not support our way of breeding...

Some very good points. I think it's reasonable to assume that the natural-rhythm birthrate would be quite lower, but the problem with a xenobiology question like this is that we really only have terrestrial data to extrapolate from. The only sentient life we're familiar with is human, and the only non-human life we're familiar with are terrestrial animals, which means that they've developed in similar environments to our own, moreso than we can realistically expect in the case of the Shofixti. (I realize, of course, that the context they were placed in is a game designed with a decidedly, and unavoidably homo-centric view, but we seem to be speculating along realistic lines for the sake of discussion). the point of saying this is to point out that human history only applies as a reference to a point. We fail miserably at population control. However, and alien culture developing in an alien environment may not have trouble at all. Sure, we can say things like "the tendency is for sentient races to act like so:" in support of the Shofixti eventually becoming a problem, but all of our ideas about how intelligent life behaves is based on our experiences. Which is to say, us, and to a lesser extent, other terrestrial lifeforms with a high degree of intelligence, like dolphins and so on.

All of which means that we can't really say that realistically speaking, the Shofixti would behave as you're saying they would, given a lack of limiting factors. However, I'd have to admit, that if taken in the context that they were created by a human mind from a human-derived societal and species archetype, you're likely right.

In which case, I'd have to say that I don't think there'd be a lack of limiting factors necessarily. Historically, the Yehat uplifted the Shofixti, and afterwards lent a guiding hand to their development, that I doubt they'd be likely to abandon, and would very likely result in the placement of externally-imposed limiting factors, put in place by the Yehat. The only real question to my mind there, is whether after the civil war and integration of Pkunk with Yehat, the resulting society would still be inclined to shepherd the younger race along. My inclination, based on my impressions of the Pkunk and Yehat in the game, would be that yes, it could continue to take a guiding hand. And if that's the case, I feel that the population growth issue would be noticed and addressed, resulting in eventual equilibrium.

Of course, that's not exactly a definitive answer, so let's look at the other side of the coin. One thing I've heard a lot of is that eventually, you run out of room for anyone to expand. Well, maybe you run out of room on the *starmap*, but that's not the boundary of the universe, either. There's a lot of space to work with and expand into, and I'm sure more than one race in the game will eventually make more room for the others. Either by dying out, or by doing like the precursors, and moving off into another region of the galaxy, or even on past to other galaxies entirely. Then there's even more options than that, as well. What's to keep, say, the Chmmr or humans or someone from taking the Arilou or Orz approach, and trancend up through the dimensional barriers? Space, especially with the added layers of hyper/quasi/etc-space parallel realities, is impossibly huge, so as to make the notion of 'running out of room' unlikely at its most plausible.

And that's not taking into account other realistic limiting factors to a culture's size. Eventually, the spread through space gets to the point where society can't support its own weight, fragments up into smaller chunks, which very well might fight among themselves. Perhaps a better point to make, though, is that with a birthrate like the Shofixti have, *evolution* is greatly sped up as well. Usually, that's not even a concern, but we're talking a long period of time, here. Long enough that evolutionary progress gets a say. One of the things about evolution, is that elements no longer necessary to survival have a way of disappearing. Humans don't need a tail. At some point, we lost having them. (assuming that bit at the end of the spinal column is, indeed, a vestigal tail as believed) Likewise, with a high birthrate no longer necessary to survival of the species, it's reasonable to assume it will gradually settle down into something more sustainable, or at least, much less worrisome.

I don't know, at this point, if I've addressed everything I originally intended to. But I'm done for now anyway.

Added: On a side note, I think it's very likely to think humans will eventually follow the Arilou's path, since the Arilou seem to have a marked interest in encouraging humans along that path, for whatever reason, and to a lesser extent, the Orz seem to rather like mankind as well, and think it'd be *happy time* if we could come hang out in the *playground*, or whatever. ;)

Actually, humans are very good at not reproducing too much when they are prosperous. It's when they're in societies which treat women as chattel, the men get drunk every day, and the average investment in a child is about the amount needed to feed them...
The average woman in, say, Nigeria, doesn't want to have more than 2 or 3 kids, but due to circumstances the fertility (average children per woman) is 7 or so.

Considering the Yehat-Punk thing. I'm sure they'd be happy to lend a guiding hand. But would the Shofixti want it? The Yehat betrayed them, they failed them. Also,the peaceful Pkunk-Yehat coexitence probably does not appeal much to honourbond Shofixti.

Good point Death. Then again, we know nothing of the current conditions on the Shofixti homeworld, or those that existed in the past. Nor how much they differ from humans society or birthcontrol wise. Nor really anything about their native wildlife. We only know how fast they breed.  Which is why I started this whole topic with a smiley, we can't really prove one way or another. until Starcon 4: The Shofixti Menace comes out anyway.

What would happen if the Shofixti turned to the humans for guidance?  I mean, the Yehat dishonored the furry rodents by not only surrendering to the Ur-Quan, but giving up hope on their race.  So, maybe the captain can be their new role models.  Imagine that role placed on you...   ;D  Thousands of little Shofixti ready to die for the cause.  Sounds like a recipe for disaster.

And I imagine we'd be all too egarer to let them die for our causes... Still, I don't think we could work as the Shofixtis mentors for long. I mean,  the human culture has very little in similar with the Shofixti. We don't believe in honour the same way as they do, we're governed increasingly by greed and self interest. they'd turn away from us in disgust quite soon I think...

you're forgetting there are many cultures on this planet.. and while things such as honor and other ways of life have been different in the past, they might and will change in the future.

Anyways, I think they'll do alright on their own, those little critters :P

There are many cultures on this planet yes, but the ones that, at this stage anyway, seem to be the ones closest to achieving spaceflight aren't all that honour bound anymore. I wodner how the differenty human cultures will be represented in a future united human race? I mean, will we necessarily meld into one unificating culture and keep our own cultures inside our homes, or will there be somethi9ng liek the UN, where all the different cultures decide upon things together, and give their views? Only if it's the second way, or if we splinter into several human empitres, will the Shofixiti have any real contact with dfifferent earth cultures.. Unless they overrun us of course : ). But still as you say, they'll probably manage. They have done quite well so far.

I would like to express my arguments about that here, but right now I am way too pessimistic to be able to make a neutral or positive statement about a possible version of the world's united future...

Pardon my Jurassic Park example.... but those dinosaurs switched genders in order to breed.  Hormones dictate that there is only ever one active queen alive in a bee-hive...

There are many ways nature safeguards itself:

1) Overpopulation causes an abundance of airbourne hormones, these cause Shofixti Maidens to produce only male offspring... or only female... or a higer percentage of homosexual / non-breeding offspring.  Or causes them to switch genders _{like the dinosaurs.. only in reverse}.

2) Overpopulation causes shortages in food supply which in turn inhibits the Shofixiti Maiden from concieving... or causes the male to cease cycling and halts arousal.

3) Overpopulation creates a social pressure towards liberal legislation, specifically 'Euthenasia'.., mass cullings ensue.

4) Perhaps the Shofixit have a very limited lifespan.  If they are adult at one year of age... perhaps they are geriatric at ten?

Those are very good points! Why didn't I come up with that?



Wouldn't that be a bummer! All the Maidens willing and you just can't, LOL  :P

Actually, for all the comments people are making about humans, it's worth noting that the current UN Population forecasts have the Earth's population topping out in 2050, and then decreasing thereafter.  This is because the current global fertility rate is around 1.8 children per woman, below the 2.1 replacement rate.  (The extra .1 is to account for children who die before reaching adulthood.)

Western European countries and Japan have particularly low fertility rates, around 1.3 to 1.4.  (Becoming wealthier is generally associated with lower fertitlity rates, as families choose to have fewer children, since each child is less likely to die.)  Of course, fertility rates could always change-- after all, it's their continued decrease that has caused the UN Population Growth estimates to be revised downwards every couple of years.

And then there's those Mormons who keep popping out an average of a dozen children each. So if things keep going like they are eventually the only people left populating the planet will be Mormon, and if you'e ever been to Utah, it's not going to be a pretty sight.

Hey, don't hate on Utah!  They've got some good stuff...
...
...
...
... well, I can't think of anything.

I know that not all the Yehat agreed to the surrender, but I said the "Yehat surrendered" meaning their time as battle thralls would be dishonorable in the eyes of the Shofixti.  Argue all you want about whether their civil war would redeem the Yehat's honour in the eyes of the Shofixti or not.

Hey, now what the *BLEEP* is wrong with a whole bunch of *BLEEPING* children, huh? And what the *BLEEP* is wrong with Utah (or you)?

(The only thing which would speak against Utah right now is that, uh, never mind...)

woah, this forum is having some problems!
I can't read what you post, it says "BLEEEP" all over.

weird.


:P

That's weird! What the *BLEEP*?
(I self-censored those words to avoid trouble...)

BLEEP THE BLEEPING BLEEPERS!  ;D

It's a spooky thought in a way. It seems that most ppl who have large families nowadays are religious, belonging to one religion or another (ok, gross over-generalization here, but still). In a democratic society, doesn't that mean that pretty soon our countries can actually vote in favor of becoming theocracies? Spooky.

As regards the hormone thingie for the shofixti and the lizard thing. I have to say that biology isn't my strongest subject, but does really apply to a race that has evolved beyond it's original habitat? I know we only have one race to base our specualtions on, but I would think that any race that finds that it needs not adapt to natures rythm, but can rather make nature adapt, would pretty soon have managed to sabotage natures safeguards against overpopulation...

As for the Yehat. they surrendered as a race, even though they didn't all agree about it. The dishonor is theirs as a race.

One thing that seems to have been missed, when you have a huge population you tend to have horrible almost unstoppable diseases , influenza, cholera, black plague anyone, which always devastate and thin out populations, Also there was a prediction made decades ago that calculated the future population of earth which could go into the 100's of billions but with one fatal flaw, it didn't account for the fact that food is limited and that limits our population and attempts to increase food production always impact environment which can create other population thinning things such as droughts leading to famines and futher population thining.

I think we have missed the simplest answer.

When replenishing the Shofixit population is not the goal... I imagine they just use condoms... or birth control pills.  In nature, food supply generally limits populations.  But given that they are sentient, they would likely have come to the same conclusion as many westerners today.

Their high birth rate is indiciative of having natural predators also... the ZotFoq had them... have the Shofixti ever mentioned being prey... they look like they could fill a BBQ.

=w=

Huge populations don't give rise to unstoppable diseases all by themselves. It's the conditions they cause (hygienic and such) that gives the diseases a chance to floursih, and malnutrition, cramped living quarters and so on account for their fast spreading and their lethality. But a civilization that has reached the starfaring stage has probably sorted a lot of this out already, and shouldn't be very vulnerable to this phenomena.

I think we covered the predator thing earlier, again, when a race gets to the spacefaring stage, such predators aren't likely to kep their numbers down very effectively.

As for birth control methods, yes it is certainly a possibility, but we can't know for sure. They might have religious reasons, as some religions here on Earth, cultural reasons, like some nations here on earth, they might not be withspread enough to completely control the population growth, and so on.

Hehe... I wouldn't wanna be the creature trying to stuff a Shofixti into a barebque.  Those claws and teeth look pretty vicious to me.  If the Shofixti have any natural foes or predators on their home planet, I'd assume they rule the food chain and beat any animal they wish with their great agility and strength.

Or they'd just send their Shofixti ninjas to kill 'em.

Well, I wouldn't really be surprised if the Shofixti had something like a personal glory device implanted after adulthood or so (after birth could cause a lot of trouble among quarreling kids...) to avoid being the main attraction of a BBC  :D

You put'em on a grill, everything seems fine, and the first time you wanna turn him around to get the other side crispy as well - KaBOOOOM!

You forgot chemical and biological weaponry research.. *cough* e.g. Iraq *cough*

Ok, points to GM for almost making me fall off my chair with the BBQ comment.

" You put'em on a grill, everything seems fine, and the first time you wanna turn him around to get the other side crispy as well - KaBOOOOM!"

;D ;D ;D I wouldn't want to be that would be BBquer. You'd not even have time to put ketchup on them!

Thanks LP, I myself chuckled when I pictured that scene  :D

It would definitely be a lot better to just insult him enough until he blows himself up, scoop up the rest, et voilà, Shofix-Tartar, medium rare (you can now go fetch the ketchup bottle!)

I don't think ketchup goes with tartar. the Shofixti have always impressed me to tell the truth,  with their willingness to die for what's right. Like those "Divine Wind" fellows. To be ready to give up your life for honour, to relaize that there are more important things than living, other things that matter more, is... impressive. Seeing as we already have a suicide bomber debate over on another thread, let me just clarify that I'm talking about fighting as a warrior, in acvtual battle here, and nothing else. I'm equally impressed by the people who stormed Normandy. To be ready to give your life for justice. That's the way I'd like to go. Well, either that, or in bed at 105 with my Syreen wife.

Amen.

Or, more Starcontrolish would probably be : HALLELUJAH!! Think what the shofixti could do with that ability...

Break the game worse than the Ploxis Plunderer?

Or in bed with 105 Syreen wives.  :D

I think if I had 105 Syreen wiwes, I'd probably die rather more quickly. not only would it be exhausting in itself (remembering anniversaries and such), but I'd have 105 mothers-in-law! Gasp, the horror.

Yes, one would probably die earlier, but happy!

And LP, why are you afraid of those Mothers-in-Law? After all, they are Syreen as well, hehehe! That would make it 210 - almost enough for a whole year-round party, uh, never mind!

(I wouldn't care as long as it stays in the family!)  ;D

Yes but if I have 105 syreen mother-in-laws, that means there must be (I assume) at least a few father-in-laws in the family as well. And I imagine that Syreen men, what with the attraction their women have on the other species, would be more than a little bit jealous, and prone to challenging you to duels all the time.

EDIT: sorry Death, didn't see your input there earlier, must've missed it somehow. Please keep in mind that when I mention these combined ship abilties, I simply jest. I know fully well that it'd unbalance the game grievously, but I am not advocating for the incorporation of these features in the game. I'm merely thinking funny thoughts, and then due to lack of self-control, I write them down in the modest hope that the rest of you will enjoy them as well. Don't woryy, I won't break it. Really, I won't :)

I thought that in the Syreen society, the men didn't have anything to say. That would make the Mothers-in-Law take up an even stronger position - hence, there is no way out: if you want their daughters, you gotta befriend them first...

"Befriend" them? I don't know what you're thinking bout here GM, but I certainly don't have the stamina for that. why would women be that dominant though (or am I simply disremembering something here?). Just because there are less of them doens't mean that much, it was just the spacefaring Syreen that were mostly women... Maybe Syreen men have the same "attraction power" as the females? now that could be dangerous....

If you took that notion and ran with it, a fairly interesting mod to the game would be a "male syreen commander" plug-in, so that straight women (and gay men, for that matter) could play too, without any sort of "ick" factor..

Lessee, all it would take is about 45 minutes of voice acting, a new script, and new artwork.  No problem!  :)

Don't forget you'll hjave to rework the ending as well... Still, shouldn't be that much a a prob, any hunks in here wanna play Syreen?  :)

Oh people, you've sank really low..
first off you've completely diverted from the topic.. it's about the Shofixti..

but more important..

you talk and compare girls to fictional SC2 characters?! have you no shame?? or, should I say, have you no girls?!?!

hmm

come to think of it, I'm not far off..

So, did you ever wonder what exactly did Talana do when she said "this, and this, and this!!!" ??

;)

Talk about sinking low....  ;D nO, I never actually qwondered. but then again, i have a very active fantasy.

And it's my topic, and I don't mind it being twisted. It usually finds its way back to the furry buggers at some stage  :)

Speaking of which, i think it's come up in another topic, but how did Tanaka survive his eight years? hibernation? and if he did, who is to say that other Marsupials that didn't make it home haven't settled elsewhere, and already overrun several star systems? We may be in danger already and not realize it...

They'd need gir... ehh, Shofixti Females, wouldn't they?
besides, I'm sure they would've just suicided on some dreadnaught or other enemy ship, don't forget Tanaka's Glory device didn't work.

Oh people, you've sank really low...
How low can you go? It's LIMBO-time!

first off you've completely diverted from the topic.. it's about the Shofixti...
Well, yes, sorry about that. But LP already answered that...

but more important...
You talk and compare girls to fictional SC2 characters? Have you no shame? Or, should I say, have you no girls?
THAT'S NONE OF YOUR FRIGGING BUSINESS! >:(
Sorry, just kidding! The real answers are:
Yes, no, and yes, right now, all I have are sweet memories of my Syreen girl (and, like LP, I have a lot of fantasy) ;D

hmm
come to think of it, I'm not far off...
Oh uh, watch it, here comes trouble! ;)

So, did you ever wonder what exactly did Talana do when she said "this, and this, and this!"?
Well, it just happens that I remember it like it was yesterday:
She first [$&$(§), then she did something that could only be described as /§(&"§/$)! and after that all she had to do (and all you could do) was ]§)$?)$%(§...  :o

Ladies und Gentlemen, I present GermanNightmare, future erotica writer extraordinaire.

You may have a future in amateur porn, GermanNigthmare.  That's actually a scary though, I'm sorry for bringing it up...   :'(  I'm now scarred for life. lol.

Imagine the Shofixti females.  I mean, the male Shofixti are strong and all, but who do you think is more domineering?  I would be frightened of a Shofixti woman.  That fact of sheer size and frightening presence alone may often scare the Shofixti mem to not want to pro-create.  Those hairy women aren't the most appealing bed-mates, in my opinion...

yes, but you aren't a hairy equally agressive male (I assume you're not that hairy anyway ;) ) I think the Shofixti do just fine on that issue.

EDIT: How do I keep missing these things!? In response to your comment Censored, yes, they would've needed females. But does anyone know for sure that all Shofixti braves are male? unlikely as it may be, some might be female... Or, some females and males may have been stuck in Yehat territory (ambassador and staff) and permitted to escape without anyone knowing it.

LOL!
(Actually, as I'm writing these lines, I'm still laughing to myself!)

D_999: Not sure about that. But if nothing else works out for me I might chose that occupation. Science Fiction Erotica.

O-S: That is nasty and you know it! You should never have brought that up!
As for the Shofixti females... Maybe there is hope and they do shave? Just a little? Any chance for it? (Ooh - man, see what you have done now!)

LP: If I didn't know it better, I'd say I now know the reason why the Shofixti males are so eager to die in combat rather than to return home to their wives... But Tanaka seemed quite thrilled with the honor we bestowed on him.

(As we're already in the depths nobody should really explore... What would you guys do if the whole human race was almost extinct, you were the only male left and all you could get your hands on was, let's say, not the prime beef you would like to repopulate earth with? And don't you start with the inner values!)

Omni-kun, you shock me with your Human-centrism!


(If no one understands, I guess I can elaborate, but I think this an acknowledged joke, I'm just being silly)

Depends on how closely modeled after feudal Japan the Shofixti are. Still, I imagine there are quite a number of formidable Shofixiti ninja. That would be rather scary! *laughs* A feral badger ninja. *cheers!*

The ninja Shofixti should have another sort of ship though...

Anyway, all of this just proves my original point. You can't trust the little buggers. Turn your back, and they'll multiply, and spread. Then either the Glory Devices or the Ninjas will finish you off.... Well, disreagrading the idea that Shofixti females need to shave and be sedated before procreation anyway....

Maybe all the female Shofixti are women...  They may be called 'maidens', but they can probably kick some ass.  I find it funny that ZEX would be interested in female Shofixti...  I would think just the thought of a lady Shofixti would frighten any race into submission.

I would have never guessed that fact! I'm glad you told us, otherwise, who knows what might have happened...

Shofixti are the REAL ULTIMATE POWER!! They flip out and kill people!!

Well, not really... They will however devour us. Omni, are you sure all shofixti females are women? Some could be girls as well ;)

Wow, I must've been on drugs at the time I wrote this.   ::)  I don't even remember what I was trying to write...

I'm sure it was prophetic and insightful, though...   ;D

Maybe you meant, maybe some of the Shofixti maidens are just little girl Shofixti?

I think I meant to say that all shofixti women may be female, but they probably don't act like the ladies we have in our society.  Imagine macho, furry warrior princesses like Xena, but on creatine.

A furry Xena? Now that's a strange picture you're painting. I swear, you and GM should write an erotic starcontrol novel together...

Why GM and not GN?

And I still maintain Shofixti females make the best ninja after all. Their males could make good samurai, I'm sure.

I dunno. I just mis-shortened it in my head somehow. Byt the time someone else actually called him GN, I'd been using it for so long that it'd just sort of stuck... But we all have our different nicks with ifferent people, don't we? GM calls me LP, you call me Luki, I call you Primat, Omni calls you K-P... It is just one of those things.

EDIT: Oh, and I'm sure female shofixti would make good ninjas. they might be more discrete than the male...

It's odd, because years ago when I was a lil nerdy junior high school girl, I would be on them BBS boards and my nickname would be 'Pri' and I have no idea why that was my nick. It just occurred to me the other day of the neat coincidence in that.

Of course I gotta call you Luki. It sounds like Lukey!
*starts singing "Lukey's Boat" by Great Big Sea*

Never heard of it. It reminds me more of Loki, Norse god of mischief. Which isn't all too misfitting either I suppose....

Your Guardian picture and your title of 'The Eternal One' made me at first think you were some sort of stuffy-headed, no-nonsense, gruff and cold adminstrator person.

Oye, but now, seeing the real you, makes me think you should have used an Umgah pic and your caption should have read, "To arms! Wait, we don't have arms! HAR HAR HAR"

I was actually gonna be an Umgah... But for some reason, at the last moment I chose this pic instead. Dunno why really, just instinct. I tend never to argue with it, it's gotten me out of more trouble than I care to remember.

And I am a nasty person, really. Gruff and cold are mymiddle names. I'm just practising my social skills here. ;)  I honestly don't know where "eternal one" came from either, it just sounded good. Probably some fantasy nook or other, I spend way too much time reading strange stuff...

Ooh! What are you thinking of! That's illegal! No parole...

Ooh! That's nasty! A furry Xena? Bah! Even I as a Germanian must deny - sorry!

*stares oddly at GN* What are YOU thinking of...

Yup, that's it! LP (that's what I call him!) has called me GM in an answer- ever since, that's what I almost expect from him ;-)

GNM is fine too (like Nightmare or Nitemare - all depending how much digits I can fill...)

It's an old nick-name I got when I graduated in the United States...

I never meant anything like that - it just sounded wrong somehow and I was picking on you - sorry!

Here we go!
May I present:

Gruff Cold Loki Pela - The Norse God of Mischief, brother to the head-honcho and he's nasty and likes the wintertime...

(Man! 2^nd day of the semester, 1^st day of classes - I just returned home, brews, buzz and all included - "Flying high again"_Ozzy

Remember the old East German women's swim team?  That's the picture I get whenever I think about the Shofixti females...  I only wonder which ones have more hair.

Anyways, enough of this nonsense!  It comes to my attention that I don't often refer to people by name or nick name when I'm on these forums.  I often just quote what people say and am too lazy to type their names, lol.  My nickname is pretty lame...  well, it's just basically my name without the 'Sama' title on the end.  By the way, my internet name translated means: "The All-Powerful Master of the Universe".  Okay, so I added a couple of words in there, but you get the idea!   :P

I thought -sama simply meant 'greatly respected one' whether it was a god, a king, your grandmother, your mentor, etc.

And Omni I figured was simple, meaning 'many'.

I mean as 'Kami-sama' you would be literally saying god,
but I thought as 'Omni-sama' it'd just mean... 'Many Things that are Respected '.

Gruff Cold Loki Pela? Good grief, your semester really is starting with a bang, isn't it?

I can certainly see where you got your nick from GM, the bare thought of your "Eddie want's Ur-Quan trophies" busting in roaring drunk in the middle of the night is enough to give me a nightmare. And that would, of course, be a German Nightmare. Damn I'm clever. Where did you get that pic from anyway, it is very good..

The Shofixti women are like the East German womens swimteam? It's a good thing no Shofixti heard you say that Omni... Or german for that matter... hmmm waitaminutenow...

Btw, I thought of another abbrevation for Omni-Samna, but it's not very funny so I wont even mention it. Bright lad like you can probably guess anyhow.

O.S. ?

Hey LP, you can't really blame that one on me - read through your last three posts: That's where I got the information for that one... ;-)

As for the East German Female Swim Team - I always thought that this information was "TOP SECRET"!

To be honest, this semester really started very well: I didn't sign any lists to participate in the classes - I just showed up and except for one class (out of six) I may, can & will participate!

As for my nick - I got it when I joined my highschool's soccer-team and they expected me to be a soccer-pro since I'm from Germany. Boy, were they mistaken! But it did scare some players from the other schools since they only heard that I'm from Germany and I always talked to my opponents in German, usually insulting them without anyone getting it, hehehe... The pic is from some Iron Maiden fan-page! (Yes, I listen to Heavy Metal, yes, Maiden is my favorite band, I like their mascot Eddie, no, I'm not crazy, although, mmh, let's not touch that topic...)

As for "Eddie" - that's another nick for, uh, well, mmh. Let's just say that I got it from my American (ex-)girlfriend who meant, uh, well, mmh, not the whole me...
[can't believe I just wrote that!]

Omni-Sama - I was always wondering about where you got the name from - good to know!

Well, I better get going and catch a couple of hours of dream-time. Tomorrow is another day, the ship is ready, the landers are waiting, the crew is eager and there's a lot of planets that need some serious C₂H₅OH-mining!

I'll meet you on the starbase. Please don't forget the limes, the cane-sugar and the ice - you're all invited!

Heh, I wanted to see what people wrote in this "Shofixti threat" thread, they certainly had much to write about the subject. So I've read the first post, then the last page... then the one before... You don't really talk about Shofixti here do you? ;)

Actually, I'm not sure what you ARE talking about, but since you mentioned nicknames and shorting them, I must say that I'm glad mine is UAF. It's so short there is no need to shorten it.

Well, seeing as everyone is in agreement with me, the thread starter about the danger of the Shofixti, and have agreed that they need be exterminated, as the thread creator, I thought it might be fun if we let ourselves go a bit. Rest assured that all that happens here, happens with my blessings. Read the middle pages as well, for some interesting reading :)

GM, your picture and the text always made think of a Predator. Wanting Quan skulls for trophys. Now that'd be an itneresting fight...

As for the Edde thing... No, I won't comment o nthat, drubnk as though I may be, we probably don't want to be getting into that venue of discussion here :)

I'll bringa couple of kilotons of salted peanuts and suchlike.

riiight....