The Ur-Quan Masters Discussion Forum

Here is something not really SC2 game related, but more after the game ends.

We know about the Talking Pets, and how the Ur-quan use them translate for them like slaves. My question is would the new Alliance make the Ur-quans stop using the pets as slaves? Or would the Captain speak-up and say it's alright because of what they really are?
(Curious to see your ideas on this)

Well, if I had any say in it, we'd have ourselves a nice little genocide. After all, at the moment the TP's are non sentient, so the moral issue is a bit fuzzy. And they are just way too dangerous to keep around. To soothe the ethics comission we could keep a maximum of 4 TP's alive, in solitary confinment cells on different planets, guarded by token fleets of alliance vechiles.

I was under the impression that only the talking pet that you take from the Umgah has psychic powers. It seemed to me that the Umgah had modified that talking pet with their bio-technology, and these modifications caused it to have psychic "flowers." So even though the other talking pets are sentient, does that necessarily mean that they are all psychic?

The other TP are both non-psychic and semi-sentient, if memory serves me right. However, any one of them can become sentient AND psychic if someone preforms the surgery on it. I'd rather not chance any weird cults or fanatics getting their hands on one.

Personally, I'd rather see all the damned proto-Dnyarri wiped out. I'm sure once the Ur-Quan are forced to accept other races as 'equals' they would deem to communicate with them on a direct level, and dispense with the Talking Pets. Especially if they were clued in to how a Dnyarri menace nearly came to rampaging through the galaxy again. On the other hand I wonder how Orz-ish the Ur-Quan would sound like without the translation facilitator...

I wouldn't wager on it being any more possible to force the ur-quan to accept other species then it would be to force the dynarri to accept them.  More likely then not, genocide against the dynarri will probably require genocide against the ur-quan too....unless you've got a brilliant plan for how to convince the ur-quan to just hand over their pets.  I wouldn't bet on that.  Especially not after the way you're bound to have pissed them off.

Well, YOU don't need to kill them. Simply tell them what happened. There are several possibilities:
1) They will kill the pets and use a modern version of babelfish instead
2) They will make the dreadnaught's auto-destruct more redundant so there's never another Alpha Pavonis
3) They will annihilate the Umgah who know how to do this.

There's no need for them to turn the pets over...

They'll probably kill the pet, upgrade their self-destruct mechanism, and the Kohr-ah would try to exterminate the Umgah, but they will try that anyway. :)

Two more things:
1) The talking pets are not sentient (or semi-sentient) but they DO have psy powers to some extent. After all this is how they translate.
2) Primat, you're on something BIG here! The pets translate thoughts, so I wonder what would happen if they'll try to translate the Orz... If they can, then maybe after one conversation the entire Ur-quan race will disappear, and many Orz would appear instead ;)

To quote one scared Arilou: "Oh no! It's a *party*!!!"

Well, the Ur-Quan would probably not share their enlightenment with the slaves, so things would get very hairy, but it would not be a simple situation like with the Androsynth.

UAF, the Dynarri would probably go insane trying to translate Orzese. :P

Personally, I think they should be eradicated. Read back in history a bit. When the Sentient Milleu found them, the Dynarri instantly dominated the Ur-Quan and started splitting them Kzer-Ah and Kohr-Ah. They're ALL psychic, but not all are sentient. Just wipe them off the face of the universe, or have the Umgah find some way to make them have no more psychic powers, as they are obviously far too dangerous to leave unchecked. Remember too, when you bring the Dynarri into the starbase, it makes Hayes say, "Nothing wrong with this cute little critter! Absolutely harmless!"

Just kill 'em.

If the Pets won't be Psychic anymore they won't be able to translate the Ur-quan.
Of course, I still say that if the Ur-quan would learn that the Pets can regain their sentience in any way, they would exterminate them.

But would they believe you if you told them?

IF nothing else but out of Pure Fear and hated They probably would. BUt I think they wouldn't destroy them, as much as Torture them, and maybe alter them even more.

If i remember All pets are Sentient, but have parts of their Brains disconnected so they are like mind-less drones. That's why the "First" Pet came back, because the Umgah just reconnected all the parts of the brain, not just the parts hurt in the crash.

I thought it might be interesting to see the Alliance be against the use of the TalkingPets, and ask for them to be freed (not believing your story about them). Making another SC saga where you [safe due to some Taloo Shield residual effect] need to find a way to destroy the now reborn Dynarri race. Funny part would be that your first allies are probably gonna be the Ur-quan this time.

Ur-Quan as allies makes for a dull game... On the other hand, I guess the same could be said for the Utwig and Chmmr. Still, it had better be something you EARN.

True, I really can't see the Ur-Quan as anything but perpetually bitterly opposed to the Alliance.

Why not? the Kzer-za are supposed to be thinkers. I'd think that eventually thay should be able to overcome their xenophobia. The Kohr-ah, on the other hand, I can see as bieng the perpetual enemy of any alliance.

To say the least, it would be VERY unlikely that the Kzer-za or Kohr-ah, even after a defeat, would be willing to change their beliefs - they've been on this path for over a drahn, which is a long long time.  A single defeat isn't going to alter centuries of religion and indoctrination.

Defeat can be cathartic.
Being defeated and treated well could conceivably help.

Still, their social structure of strict hierarchy is not well-oriented towards alliances of equals.
I think they may end up being independent, on speaking terms with the alliance. Not members.

Of course, what happens really depends on what they decide to do about the rest of the universe. What of the Path of Now and Forever? Will it become the Path of Then and Quite a Long Time Thereafter? Will they narrow the path to psychic races? Will they work to ensure that no one race ever has  all the force in the galaxy? That could pit them against the Chmmr personally, without having a problem with the other species. Actually, it sounds like a pretty good idea...

yeah, frigging chmmr...

You do them a favor and free them and what do they do? They turn your flagship that you worked so hard to build up and they turn it into a bomb.

Bah  ;D

But in SC3, the Kzer-Ah do change their tune and join the Alliance. (The Kohr-Ah too, to some extent, but they just get mopey and leave  :P) The Kzer-Ah change the name of their Doctrine to "The Path of Endless Vigil", essentially the same, but without the preemptive strike buisness. I don't know what the Kohr-Ah do, they run away early in the game, Anti-Coreward, I believe. It's been quite awhile.

And in starcon 3, the precursors turn out to be friggin cows.  The phrase "Extensive liberties taken with the cast" applies very heavily to SC3.  "Extraordinairly well thought out development" doesn't.

Well, Cows (Ortogs) ARE kind of shaggy giants, if you have really big cows.

Still, on these boards, SC3 is relegated to the same bin as fan-fiction.

I honestly can't see a galactic race bent on racial supremecy ideals to just keel over and go soft.

Sympathy for its wretched slaves is one thing turning onto your back and showing your belly is another altogether..

Star Control just isn't Star Control without the Ur-Quan as the arch villains. Besides, SC2 could've easily ended with you making friends with all the hierarchy thralls. But it forces you to piss off the Mycon and the Thraddash, and retain cold terms with the VUX and Ilwrath and even Umgah. And the Spathi clearly don't want anything to do with your alliance; they just want to do what will keep them alive. I even imagine the Crimson Coporation might find the Hierarchy more to its liking than the Alliance after your antics with a certain fleet guarding a certaini bomb.

Maybe they'll just keel over? After all, a defeat such as this could unravel their society as well, amke them disorganized enough to be... made slaves? I doubt the alliance is just gonna stand by without and let them keep their "Planetary Seige Units".

I think that the way that the war works out could be a significant factor in the sequel (rather than, say, waiting forty years)

The Ur-Quan might've been dominating, malicious creatures for a long time, but remember, they were slaves before they became slave masters. As for what D_999 said earlier about just psychics, the Kzer-Ah would have to smoke the Pkunk and the Syreen too, in that case.  :P
Hierarchial Despotism is what the Ur-Quan have lived in for a long time, yes. Perhaps they could keep that, but also be part of the Alliance. Remember, it's the race as a whole that's equal to all others, but all these collective races have their own forms of gov't. It's not like the Alliance dominates their inter-personal gov't systems, just interstellar.

In the end of The Ur-quan Masters the captain destroys the Sa-matra, the symbol of Ur-quan superiority. By destroying their 'great trophy' he pretty much forced a change in their society. I'm not saying the Ur-quan would become allies or anything, but they would likely have a lot of internal conflict because of the loss.

at the end both ur-quan would space the the talking pets
( you know flush them out the air lock)
what would you do lord 9900000000 ::)
what would you do war master 38%70009 ;D