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Author Topic: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers*  (Read 78217 times)
Matt
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #75 on: December 13, 2002, 05:05:34 am »

Two quick comments:

One: The Orz are one of my favorite races; they are certainly a large part of what makes SC what it is. Just think about it... everyone you meet who mentions them tells you that they are dangerous and can't be trusted. The Androsynth disappeared just as the Orz appeared - in the same region. They attack you for mentioning the Androsynth too much, and seem very suspicious. Basically, everything points to these guys being evil. Yet, their "translation problems" give them the funniest speech of all, and make them seem simply silly! I just love how that works.

Second: Just before they disappeard, the Precursors were apparently worried. "They were always hurrying from place to place, seeking knowledge as though they were in a desperate search for some important secret," the Slylandro tell us. The Androsynth, just before they disappeared. were desperately searching their computer systems for any information that could possibly save them... coincidence? Probably, but still something to think about. After all, it was apparently the Androsynth's experiments with multidimensional travel that led to their destruction... The Precursors were so advanced that it seems strange that they would never have done similar experiments. As a far larger and more spread out race, their destruction may have taken years... far longer than the destruction of the Androsynth.
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #76 on: December 13, 2002, 05:35:52 am »

All I have to say is that reading the Warlok files from Timewarp's site is very informative, howeverit also kinda ruins the plot if Timewarp follows it (and a very fitting name too).
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #77 on: December 13, 2002, 06:39:33 am »

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*alliance party* = war alliance, therefor still refers to war. Even the Orz must *feel*, that they alone cannot pick it up against all others. And the humans are weak enough to be slayed later. At least at the moment you ask them.... Wink


This raises a question though; why the opposing meanings between the two?  *party* by itself in your opinion would seem to mean a definite fight between the Orz and whoever they were talking to.  Ex: We're going to have a *party* with so and so.  *Alliance party*, though, would have to be towards someone else, since the Orz join your side.  Granted, they seem to invade your star base, but they don't cause any harm; they seem like they're just looking at all the pretty buttons, and they do give you their ship designs.

So why would *party* and *Alliance party* have two opposite meanings/direct objects?  Only if *Alliance* were a sort of negatory adjective like "anti" on top of its normal function of giving the idea of teaming up, but you'd think the translator devices would at least be able to find a sort of closer match than that which would be less confusing if that really was the case. (less confusing being the operative word, since everything about the Orz is never clear, just several layers of confusion. Maybe that's what they're talking about with *above* and *below*; a high or low level of absolute, "out of it" confusion Grin )
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #78 on: December 13, 2002, 06:47:14 am »

maybe *Alliance* is a modifier, that means something like "with other people".

it isn't really an opposite meaning, it just means that the people the Orz plan to *dance* with aren't the people right there.
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #79 on: December 13, 2002, 10:32:04 am »

Quote

*alliance party* = war alliance, therefor still refers to war. Even the Orz must *feel*, that they alone cannot pick it up against all others. And the humans are weak enough to be slayed later. At least at the moment you ask them.... Wink

I'm sorry Krulle, but I still don't get how *party* can possibly mean "war"?
Take for instance this line from the Orz:
I am already telling the everything story. It is too much.  You do not asking about us the many.  Next it is the *party* and you will *become*.  It is best.  After this you are so *happy* you do not ask the many questions.  Do you anticipate? Yes! You do!  I am too *tired* the *silly* word *game*.
"Next it is the war and you will *become*  It is best.  After this you are so *happy* you do not ask the many questions."Huh?
That just doesn't seem to fit.  Now, if *party* were to mean some process you will go through, with the help of the Orz, after which you will *become* (change into something new?).  That just makes more sense.  And if *alliance* does not mean our meaning for "alliance", than it must mean something else ... some other kind of joining.  A "joining process" makes sense to me.  Whether this means the Orz will absorb you, or you wil take on some new form of existence, I don't know, but it sounds a lot better than war.
This is my *house.* Did you come to *play*?.  Do not be sad if you are *other*. We can still have a *party*.  There are never enough *campers*.
Do not be sad if you are *other*(which I take to mean "enemy" based on other things they say).  We can still have a war"Huh?
You want to *take* *silly* words in *slow time*. It is okay.  I will *spit* words and then perhaps it is the *party*.  Welcome to my *house* or *other house*.  It is a joke! Only it is my *house*.
I will *spit* words and then perhaps it is the war."Huh?
Pleasant *combinations*! We have been *anticipating* about you.  Do you like *parties*? We do several times, and so much the better.
and
So much *juicy*! Let's have *party time* sooner.
Although I do admit lines like this:
If you are *sick* you should have a *party*.
We can come and *play* at your *house*.

and
*Extra sick fish* need *special training* for extra *fun*.  We will have a *happy party* now.
do seem to point to hostilities, but I still think the Orz are trying to tell you that if you went through the process, you'd understand them better and not be so hostile to them.
They say:
Going. Yes. Orz is go with you same place for *party*.  Nobody is forget.  Next is *alliance* *party*. Always promise is good to keep.  So much pleasure is coming, Orz and the you is change together as soon as *camping* is started.  You are not even aware, and then everyone is so happy.  You are not forget. Alliance is promise.
Orz are wait.

The line about changing together once *camping* is started hints that the Orz intend for you to go through some change with them or with their help.
And this line just kills the war meaning for me:
Orz is upset! Not one the many!  We are *squeezing* the *juice*!  You are showing that you are not *happy campers*  and so Orz cannot have the *party*.  Orz need *party* or there is no fun and we are *frumple*  everyday.  This is so sad, Orz is upset of course.
If we are not *happy campers* then the Orz cannot have the war?Huh  Orz need war or there is no fun and we are *frumple* everyday?Huh
If I am to believe you, then the Orz are the kin of Klingons because it would mean they REALLY love wars.
There's more:
*Sorry* is good fun. Yes, we are see it is the *game*.  You are strangest *campers*, but Orz is understand now.  We will come to your *house* and we will be *sorry* too.  Then is *partytime*.  Oh, the funny *joke* is *sorry*. There are no more *silly cows*.  This is *happy town* after all!
and
Orz are not *dissolve*! Why is the *silly cow* say Orz are *dissolving*?  Too much crazy perhaps. You are so sick even for a *party*.  Again I am *squeezing* the *juice*. Nnnggaaaahhh!!  It does not even helping.
and
Orz cannot be *strange*. Orz is Orz. Strange is other thing.  You are the *silliest cow* even more so.  At least you can *dance* with Orz.  After the *dancing* Orz think you will make good *special sauce*.  Maybe even for other Orz *party*, so do not be sad.
and
Who is it? It is the *not Campers*.  Maybe you have come to Taalo *playground* for a *Picnic*.  No!!! It is not the case! *Silly Cows* can never have a *picnic*.  Of course. Not even a party.  If you are gone, Orz can have fun some more.
and
Yes. Yes. You say words, then I say.  It is fun *in between*. More fun than *dancing*.  Many *gravity centers* in *heavy space* make good *party places*.  This is why we like the *New Town*. So many *Campers* and then what?  Even the *Playgrounds*! Such a surprise!  At this *Playground*, Taalo are making *Time jokes*. It is too funny for the Orz.  Taalo are in *heavy space* and next what?  They spread to *Pretty Space* because Dnyarri are chasing them.  Now Dnyarri are sleeping, so Orz can *chase* them.
Then we can have a *party*. They are even better *campers* than you.  Do not feeling bad. You are good enough *campers*, but not yet.

It seems to me that the Orz want you and the Taalo to go through this *party* (this process), but the Taalo are avoiding them.  It's not a war, it's something completely different.
Only *campers* can go to the *playground*.  *Alliance parties* are often a good idea for better *parties*.  Even for *picnics*.  Do you want to be *campers* for the *friendly days*?
and
Who are you? You are not Orz! We are Orz! Orz are happy *people energy* from the outside.  Inside is good. So much good that Orz will always *germinate*.  Can you come together with Orz for *parties*?
and
Here is *bright* and *smooth*. The other place is *hurt* Orz too much tired for keeping together.
Other place is **Frumple**. Orz are here now, but almost not yet.  Soon Orz are really here! You are help Orz with *parties*.  Orz looking for you, and find you. So much joy!!
Now *smooth* place all the time, and after now never going back to outside.  Never!!

and
This is my *house*. Do you want to know a *secret*? Do not *think* it to *not campers*.  You are so many *lonely* *juicy* *bubbles*. It is so sad.  Now that you are *campers* you will have more *parties*  and no more *sad* *lonely* *bubbles*.  This is the *secret*.
and
I am *expanding!* It is so much *squishy* to *smell* you!  *Campers* are the best! I have *anticipation* and then what?  Better parties in *the middle* for sure.
and
You are a *silly* *camper*. I am always Orz.  If I was not Orz, then I would not be, but of course I am Orz.  We are from *outside*. Also the Arilou *quick babies* are from *outside*.  It is the same, but not.  Orz are from *below*, Arilou are from *above*.  Orz does not like Arilou. Arilou are too much trouble.  We can not have *parties* when Arilou always *jumping in front*.  It makes Orz *frumple* so much.  These are *fat* words. Do you want to play this some more?
and
Pleasant *combinations*! We have been *anticipating* about you.
Do you like *parties*? We do several times, and so much the better.

and
So much the better! Orz have been waiting for *alliance* time.  I will show you the inside.  It is so good that you will never leave.  Oh, I am so excited for expecting *alliance parties*.  Yes! Yes! Reconsider is best.
and
Jumping *peppers*!! This is smiley time!
You are *campers* after all!!  We will start *alliance* *parties* for better enjoyment!

and
Yes! Think and then do! You will tell us soon. Soon is now.  *Parties* can be so much fun for other reasons.  *Alliance* is good.
and
We are not *dead*. Orz is never *dead*.
Orz is thinking *silly cow* are want to *dance*.  Orz can *dance* very well *in between* but not as much fun as *parties*.

and
I *smell* you so much. *Campers* are pleasant.  You are coming again to the *Playground*.  We can have extra fun for future *parties* in *quick time*.
and
I am so sad myself. You are not here and then I do not think of *parties*.  Oh well. It is so much excitement for the next time.  You must leave now so then you must come back.  Yes. I understand very well.

If you bothered to read through all these, you can see that the Orz speak of parties so much, it may be the single most important thing to them.  I am not saying I know exactly what party means to the Orz, but I very much doubt it means "war".
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #80 on: December 13, 2002, 11:07:46 am »

Well, it's late, so I'm not going to make a long-winded reply, but if you ask me, a *party* sounds like a process where the Orz can bring more of themselves over into the *smooth* space, aka TrueSpace.  Apparently though, it needs willing participants, for them to "anchor" on to in order to pull themselves into TrueSpace, maybe?
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #81 on: December 13, 2002, 11:40:20 am »

Quote
Well, it's late, so I'm not going to make a long-winded reply, but if you ask me, a *party* sounds like a process where the Orz can bring more of themselves over into the *smooth* space, aka TrueSpace.  Apparently though, it needs willing participants, for them to "anchor" on to in order to pull themselves into TrueSpace, maybe?


Garthor, that sounds right.  If they used the Androsynth *juice* or *sauce* to become more solid in TrueSpace, then they would need more *happy campers* to bring more of them here.  They seem to express that this space is easier for them and that they were hurt where they came from.

So, perhaps they did not kill the Androsynth, nor eat them, but rather the Androsynth are in some way, now part of the Orz.  This would fit the Arilou words:
There are no more Androsynth now. Only Orz.
Perhaps the Orz need to use matter from living beings from our universe in order to take form here.  This would also explain why the Androsynth were looking up ghosts.  If the Orz first appeared without solid form, they would be very much like ghosts.

And as for "long-winded", yes, my replies are often that, but thanks for the offhanded remark.   Grin

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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #82 on: December 13, 2002, 12:02:18 pm »

Ah the conversation turned to alien speech.  :-/ I always hated talking about it as it seemed that some get too sucked into it for my taste (ie: the translater does so and so therefor it should've put a better world in the place of *smell*). To me it's less of a translater and more of a script, it doesn't have to make complete sense (as long as it explains the game well enough, like it does, it's fine by me). Anyway, that said, I'm not even going to bother trying to respond, but I do have something new regarding "easy places" PsiPhi....

I was talking to the Arilou again and I realized something new. They said that there is only one naturally accuring portal from "hyperspace to quasi-space." So I was thinking that maybe there were 9 other, natural portals, which are based in different dimensions and that those are the Arilou's easy places. Ah well. I doubt we'll ever fully understand what an easy place is (besides that one time the Arilou never bring it up again).  :-/
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #83 on: December 13, 2002, 01:38:41 pm »

Yeah ZeroArmy, that's kind of what I meant yesterday when I said:

Quote
Yeah, you are right and there are 15 entrances from Quasi to Hyper.  Even though it does say only natural portal, I wonder if they ommited "in this quadrant".  Pure speculation.  Other than that, no idea what an easy place is then.


Speculation on them being in other dimesions, just as likely.

Oh, and about the excessive quoting.  Sorry about that.  I think it's obvious I love to analyze things to death (why else would I be on a forum?),  I mean, after all, I am the guy who had made an attempt at an Orz dictionary 8 years ago.

-PsiPhi
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #84 on: December 13, 2002, 02:01:59 pm »

Quote

Well that could be so, but it seems to be that the hyperspace Arilou aren't trying to hold anymore information


Yep, seems that *nggn* aren't the Orz. You have me convinced. Smiley

Quote
Did you read what I said? I was saying that the Taalo entered the Orz's dimension themselves (in a post before I explained why I thought the Taalo could enter quasi-space when they met the Milieu). There was no way the Orz could've dragged the Taalo into their dimension 22 thousand years ago. For one they'd have to be friends with the Taalo to save them from the Ur-Quan (the Orz only make alliances when it suits them) and they'd have to KNOW about this space (remember they didn't even know it exsisted until the Androsynth's experements).


I think that Taalo didn't *slide* to Orz's dimension but something else. When Orz arrived to truespace they found about Taalo.
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #85 on: December 13, 2002, 02:45:17 pm »

Quote

I'm sorry Krulle, but I still don't get how *party* can possibly mean "war"?
[...........]
If you bothered to read through all these, you can see that the Orz speak of parties so much, it may be the single most important thing to them.  I am not saying I know exactly what party means to the Orz, but I very much doubt it means "war".
Okay, i must confess that it doesn't seem completly rigth to me anymore. Although the translation did work for me quite good for a while. But i never translated
*party* := war, but *party* = +- war (e.g. any engagement to change one or the others status as living). And that seems be quite fitting with the other lines:
Quote
Orz cannot be *strange*. Orz is Orz. Strange is other thing.  You are the *silliest cow* even more so.  At least you can *dance* with Orz.  After the *dancing* Orz think you will make good *special sauce*.  Maybe even for other Orz *party*, so do not be sad.
So I annoy the Orz about something. But they are happy, that I can *dance* them. (BTW, I never had this line, do they say this while we're *allied*?)
Quote
Going. Yes. Orz is go with you same place for *party*.  Nobody is forget.  Next is *alliance* *party*. Always promise is good to keep. So much pleasure is coming, Orz and the you is change together as soon as *camping* is started.  You are not even aware, and then everyone is so happy. You are not forget. Alliance is promise. Orz are wait.
So Orz plans something with us. And he promises so. And the change starts the moment we ally. But the change seems to change Orz as well. But since nobody is able to understand what's happening, we might just have to wait. Maybe someone can ask Orz, if only some volunteers can enjoy the *party*, so that we can better understand, before all of humanity enjoys the *party*. Maybe that's possible, since Orz is ready to wait for us. Wink
Quote
So much the better! Orz have been waiting for *alliance* time.  I will show you the inside.  It is so good that you will never leave.  Oh, I am so excited for expecting *alliance parties*.  Yes! Yes! Reconsider is best.
Okay, Orz whishes to show us the *inside*, his inside?  Tongue
Quote
I am already telling the everything story. It is too much.  You do not asking about us the many.  Next it is the *party* and you will *become*.  It is best.  After this you are so *happy* you do not ask the many questions.  Do you anticipate? Yes! You do!
*become* part of him?  Tongue And according to Orz, we are anticipating (and thus waiting) for this to happen, although we might not know it ourself. Therefor the *change* cannot be something terrible according to the view of Orz. And if he needs us just for himself to live, i do not think he'd say something like us anticipating the *becoming*.
Quote
I will *spit* words and then perhaps it is the *party*.
That can be translated as i suggested first with war. It is a common knowledge, that words can hurt more than weapons. So why can't a war follow some *spit* words. And *spiting* can mean the careless use of words. And history of earth shows us enough examples, that this can lead to very bloody wars.

For a new conclusion to me:
Orz whishes us to join *his party* to *become*, although he might show us the *party* *inside* and we'll never leave the *party* because we are enjoying ourselves there.
Sounds a little bit like the Borg to me. The Hive is now outside this dimension but whishes to spread to this dimension by making *campers* *become* part of the *inside* on a *party*.

Don't take this Borg-idea al too seriously, the idea might stay the same (the *squirting colors* could be our mind connecting to the hive, the *change* (assimilation) could convert our body, so that formerly differently looking drones all look the same. And a *finger* is therefore the single entity part of the hive). Just as another idea which came up to me. But even the Borg figth to expand. And even to the Borg expansion is important. Therefor war remains important to the Borg. If Orz is something like the Borg-Queen, the the Orz are the Borg-drones, and these have to fight for the expansion of Orz (the Borg-Queen.Okay, here it starts sounding like the Mycon spreading the Juffo-Wup.
Should be enough for now.

But I thank you, PsiPhi for this productive discussion. Makes me discover more and more sideways of the SC-Universe. Thanks TFB, especially the Twin Gods Of Everlasting Entertainment Fred Ford and Paul Reiche!!!!!!! I really enjoy this universe you've designed so many years ago...
« Last Edit: December 13, 2002, 02:48:47 pm by Krulle » Logged
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #86 on: December 13, 2002, 03:02:40 pm »

Quote
Yeah ZeroArmy, that's kind of what I meant yesterday when I said:


Speculation on them being in other dimesions, just as likely.


Oh sorry, I must've read past that.

Quote
Oh, and about the excessive quoting.  Sorry about that.  I think it's obvious I love to analyze things to death (why else would I be on a forum?),  I mean, after all, I am the guy who had made an attempt at an Orz dictionary 8 years ago.

-PsiPhi


heh, don't feel bad I'm the king of quotes. Wink But, anyway, at least you don't quote things incorrectly (remember the Ultron thing?).  Grin

Quote


Yep, seems that *nggn* aren't the Orz. You have me convinced. Smiley


Happy days and jubilation! My endless ranting and re-reading things, from the game, finally payed off!   Wink

Quote
I think that Taalo didn't *slide* to Orz's dimension but something else. When Orz arrived to truespace they found about Taalo.


Oh ok, I wasn't sure exactly what you meant before. Anyway, it makes sense, but I still don't get that what they mean by *time tricks.* It seems as though it would mean that the Taalo did something to them at one point or another and since the Taalo aren't in True-space anymore, it would have to mean that it happened in another dimension. Then again the Orz aren't known for making complete sense, so who knows.  :-/
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*Party*
« Reply #87 on: December 13, 2002, 05:05:48 pm »

Quote
maybe *Alliance* is a modifier, that means something like "with other people".
Thank you ErikLich. Makes it easier for me to support my view of *things*.

Quote
This raises a question though; why the opposing meanings between the two?  *party* by itself in your opinion would seem to mean a definite fight between the Orz and whoever they were talking to.  Ex: We're going to have a *party* with so and so.  *Alliance party*, though, would have to be towards someone else, since the Orz join your side.  Granted, they seem to invade your star base, but they don't cause any harm; they seem like they're just looking at all the pretty buttons, and they do give you their ship designs.

Ship designs: We cannot use them when Orz leaves us. That's one of the most important basics in SC2. You have the designs but no officers to fly the ship.
*party* - *alliance party*: war - warcomrades. It isn't the opposite, but it ain't the same thing.It's the same, but then it is not.
BTW: The fight between Orz and the one he's been talking to is the *dance*.
Orz on starbase watching pretty buttons: They prepare to take the starbase apart??? Mind you, this is just another theory! And the starbase is constructed by the Ur-Quan Kzer-Za but doesn't need any Ur-Quan to be run. Therefor Orz might be interested in copying the design to run one himself, or to understand it before running this one after your assimilation.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2002, 05:09:08 pm by Krulle » Logged
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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #88 on: December 13, 2002, 11:53:57 pm »

That's an interesting new theory, PsiPhi...  a bit borg-ish, but hey, it too fits all the facts...

That doesn't quite explain the Taalo though.  If they had been changed by the Orz, the Orz wouldn't speak of them as they do.  So where DID they go?

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Re: Arilou and the Orz: What's the Deal? *spoilers
« Reply #89 on: December 14, 2002, 02:42:37 am »

Quote

Okay, i must confess that it doesn't seem completly rigth to me anymore. Although the translation did work for me quite good for a while. But i never translated
*party* := war, but *party* = +- war (e.g. any engagement to change one or the others status as living). And that seems be quite fitting with the other lines:
So I annoy the Orz about something. But they are happy, that I can *dance* them. (BTW, I never had this line, do they say this while we're *allied*?)

Yes, this is what I am thinking as well.  I could see *party* meaning "war", or at least appearing to be a war to us humans in certain uses of the word.  This is what I was saying earlier when I said:
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I think the main things to keep in mind are these:
- We all know that the Orz sense of reality is completely different from ours.
- all words that appear in ** can mean more than just one thing.  For any one familiar with Heinlein's Stranger in a Strange Land, I like to think of these "words" as if they are like the word "grok".  They mean many things at many times often depending on the situation.  It will be difficult for you to understand because you lack the experiece/knowledge/sense due to your physical limitations and/or alternate upbringing.
- The Orz have a completely different agenda from ours.  We are looking for allies in a war.  The Orz really have no care or concept of why this is important to us.  Rather, it seems to me that it is more important that they somehow *pull* or bring *happy*(willing) *campers* (explorers, volunteers) to go through some kind of change.

I am glad you are starting to see this as well.  I concede that there are places where war seems to be the best fit, but I just think there is so much more behind the word *party*, as is every other word inside **, that *party* is a concept we can never completely understand, unless we were to go through it, but who knows if we would then be able the same after it.  Most likely not.

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So Orz plans something with us. And he promises so. And the change starts the moment we ally. But the change seems to change Orz as well. But since nobody is able to understand what's happening, we might just have to wait. Maybe someone can ask Orz, if only some volunteers can enjoy the *party*, so that we can better understand, before all of humanity enjoys the *party*. Maybe that's possible, since Orz is ready to wait for us. Wink
Okay, Orz whishes to show us the *inside*, his inside?  Tongue
*become* part of him?  Tongue And according to Orz, we are anticipating (and thus waiting) for this to happen, although we might not know it ourself. Therefor the *change* cannot be something terrible according to the view of Orz. And if he needs us just for himself to live, i do not think he'd say something like us anticipating the *becoming*.
That can be translated as i suggested first with war. It is a common knowledge, that words can hurt more than weapons. So why can't a war follow some *spit* words. And *spiting* can mean the careless use of words. And history of earth shows us enough examples, that this can lead to very bloody wars.

Yes, in this case, I agree with you.  The Orz do not view *party* as a bad thing and they think that if we ally with them, then we want this change.

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For a new conclusion to me:
Orz whishes us to join *his party* to *become*, although he might show us the *party* *inside* and we'll never leave the *party* because we are enjoying ourselves there.
Sounds a little bit like the Borg to me. The Hive is now outside this dimension but whishes to spread to this dimension by making *campers* *become* part of the *inside* on a *party*.

Don't take this Borg-idea al too seriously, the idea might stay the same (the *squirting colors* could be our mind connecting to the hive, the *change* (assimilation) could convert our body, so that formerly differently looking drones all look the same. And a *finger* is therefore the single entity part of the hive). Just as another idea which came up to me. But even the Borg figth to expand. And even to the Borg expansion is important. Therefor war remains important to the Borg. If Orz is something like the Borg-Queen, the the Orz are the Borg-drones, and these have to fight for the expansion of Orz (the Borg-Queen.Okay, here it starts sounding like the Mycon spreading the Juffo-Wup.
Should be enough for now.

This is a very good metaphor.  Although, yes they are not the Borg, perhaps they may be something similar.  Yes, survival is important to all species.  I always saw Juffo-Wup to be the Mycon's coding instructions, in essence, their DNA.  If they are a construct and a tool for some other unknown, greater race (perhaps the Precursors), then as part of their DNA, there is an agenda, instructions with the intent to spread.  They brag about their DNA being so much more complex than ours and the Umgah confirm this.  If Juffo-Wup is a shortened way to describe Mycon DNA, and/or their overall agenda, than spreading their DNA throughout the galaxy is extremely important.  This goes for the Orz as well.  They have some unknown and complex agenda and *parties* definitely describes it, but in a way we cannot fully grasp.  If part of Juffo-Wup is making war, then part of having *parties* may have to do with making war.
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But I thank you, PsiPhi for this productive discussion. Makes me discover more and more sideways of the SC-Universe. Thanks TFB, especially the Twin Gods Of Everlasting Entertainment Fred Ford and Paul Reiche!!!!!!! I really enjoy this universe you've designed so many years ago...

Yes, absolutely.  Through reasonable collective discussion, we can come togehter to agree that both our points can fit into the meanings.  This is just part of the brilliance of this game.  It always leaves you guessing and dying for more.  There is always things you don't get to understand, but are driven mad trying.  Paul and Fred definitely captured this and used it to make all these people completely addicted to their story.

To ErekLich:  I don't claim this theory as my own.  It is only through discussion with others that I've come to see this as a possibility.  I have always believed the Orz to be a singular creature (at least of mind) with multiple *fingers* appearing to us.  It seems that others agree with this theory, thereby validating that my thinking was not completely out there.  Other people on this forum have referred to the Orz as a "hive mind" before Krulle compared them to the Borg here.
  As for the Taalo, make no mistake.  I've never said that they are now part of the Orz or are even willing to go through this *party* experience.  If any thing, it seems that they are completely uninsterested and trying to avoid the Orz.  Perhaps, like the Arilou, the Taalo have met the Orz in their travels in other dimensions when they escaped from this dimension.  The Orz seem to be after them for having a *party* with them.  Perhaps the Orz feel that finding the Taalo *Playground* makes this easier for them.  They are now closer to finding the Taalo.

Thank you Krulle for sharing your points and backing them with plausible data.  I only try to do the same.  I think through calm, reasonable discussion, we can learn more by fleshing out our points in a constructive manner.

-PsiPhi
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