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Author Topic: what is the metachron dialogue?  (Read 6081 times)
Tohoya
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what is the metachron dialogue?
« on: March 25, 2007, 12:30:27 am »

I've heard it referenced in a few threads here, but a curosry search of the boards reveals nothing illuminating.  What were they, and is there a link to the original removed lines?
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countchocula86
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2007, 12:43:55 am »

From what I remember, its the way you know theres a time limit. The Melnorme trader had aquired the metachrone, and it changed colour depending on its fate. But then it suddenly turned black, and from this Greenish determined that this part of the galaxy only had 4 years left.
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2007, 12:47:05 am »

Quote from: Trade Master Greenish
How nice to see you again, Captain.
Before we go on, I have a small announcement.
As you may know, in our travels throughout the galaxy
we Melnorme have found many strange and interesting alien artifacts.
One of these devices is the MetaChron, a kind of trans-time alarm system.
In a nutshell, it warns me of future dangers by predicting its own demise
which is most likely linked to my own well being, since I keep it under my pillow.
The unit is a small pyramid and, when all is well, white in color.
But if we are proceeding along a timeline which will eventually result in the destruction of the MetaChron
the unit slowly darkens. Presumably, it will be destroyed at the same time as it turns completely black.
When we first entered this region of space, the MetaChron was white.
Now it is light gray.
At its present rate of change, something will destroy the MetaChron
in the early part of the year 2159.
In order to avoid this unpleasantness, we may be leaving just before this time
so if you have business you wish to conduct with us
I suggest you do so before January 2159, or February at the latest.

Smiley
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Megagun
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2007, 11:58:12 am »

Ah, Tsing... Our resident lurking quote-bot... Smiley
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Valaggar
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2007, 12:04:53 pm »

For any future quote-searching needs, I recommend using this page:
http://starcontrol.classicgaming.gamespy.com/scwc/sc2_dialogue_files.shtml
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jucce
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2007, 12:27:12 pm »

I was just thinking about the metachron before. If it turns black when it will be destroyed in the current timeline then it really shouldn't matter if the Melnorme leaves. I mean him leaving must be a part of the timeline too?
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Valaggar
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2007, 02:20:57 pm »

No, the MetaChron alerts of dangers that will come if you remain in the same place - it doesn't predict the imminence of its demise, but the imminence of its demise if some action is not taken.
It's very unscientifical, but that's it.
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Megagun
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2007, 02:36:36 pm »

For any future quote-searching needs, I recommend using this page:
http://starcontrol.classicgaming.gamespy.com/scwc/sc2_dialogue_files.shtml
I believe that one is missing a few dialogues..

http://www.sa-matra.net/quotes/ should contain everything that there is.. Plus it looks better Cheesy
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Valaggar
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2007, 02:39:20 pm »

Ah, if I think of it, it's scientifically possible in this Star Control-like system:

Everyone has a soul/something that does not obey standard natural laws and constitutes the free will of that individual.
The MetaChron predicts its demise if no such a free will intervenes (by projecting its "tendrils" into the future).

However, the actions of free will may move the Universe from one timeline to another, rendering the MetaChron's prediction obsolete (since it applied only to that specific timeline).
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jucce
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2007, 03:27:42 am »

Ah, if I think of it, it's scientifically possible in this Star Control-like system:

Everyone has a soul/something that does not obey standard natural laws and constitutes the free will of that individual.
The MetaChron predicts its demise if no such a free will intervenes (by projecting its "tendrils" into the future).

However, the actions of free will may move the Universe from one timeline to another, rendering the MetaChron's prediction obsolete (since it applied only to that specific timeline).
Perhaps, but isn't the Ur-Quan's free will the reason for its demise?
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Novus
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2007, 02:00:36 pm »

Another explanation is that the Metachron is estimating the probability of destruction in the current location (within some period of time into the future) based on e.g. amount of destroyed ships in the area or some similar estimate of danger that would clearly increase if the Kohr-Ah take over the place. Taking individuals or Precursor vessels into account would be much harder to do, anyway, and they probably wouldn't figure into this calculation.
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2007, 02:11:18 pm »

Quote from: jucce
Perhaps, but isn't the Ur-Quan's free will the reason for its demise?
If you mean the Ur-Quan Kohr-Ah, yes. But a free will that has already been established - cleansing all sentience is a decision they had took long ago, back in the times of officer Kohr-Ah, from whom their name comes.
So the Universe is already in that timeline for a long time.

Quote from: Novus
Another explanation is that the Metachron is estimating the probability of destruction in the current location (within some period of time into the future) based on e.g. amount of destroyed ships in the area or some similar estimate of danger that would clearly increase if the Kohr-Ah take over the place. Taking individuals or Precursor vessels into account would be much harder to do, anyway, and they probably wouldn't figure into this calculation.
No, because the real probability is 0% (or extremely small) until February 2159, and 99.99% in February 2159. It doesn't increase gradually.
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Zeep-Eeep
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2007, 05:30:12 pm »

I think the device calculates the time-to-destruction if the device stays in the same place. I don't
think it has anything to do with free-will or potential time-lines, the device could be much
more simple than that. The quote from Greenish suggests the device's shade depends on
its location.
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Valaggar
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2007, 05:37:16 pm »

Then why doesn't it predict your attack on the Inevitably Successful in All Circumstances?
I mean, the Trader shouldn't be in Alpha Centauri anymore if Greenish knew that you are going to attack him.

A possible argument for your explanation would be that you learn of the MetaChron's existence only after you can't attack Greenish anymore. If you choose to attack him, then it means that the MetaChron doesn't exist. (so there are two storylines: Greenish survives and the MetaChron exists AND Greenish is dead and the MetaChron never existed).

However, you can retreat from the fight with Greenish and apologize. And after a while, you'll learn about the MetaChron.
So this is not a valid argument.
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Draxas
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Re: what is the metachron dialogue?
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2007, 07:24:13 pm »

No, because the real probability is 0% (or extremely small) until February 2159, and 99.99% in February 2159. It doesn't increase gradually.

Sure it does, though it is probably a more abrupt transition than the one it actually takes. The Metachron, presumably, should start to rapidly darken immediately after the Kohr-Ah win the Doctrinal Conflict (because that would be when the Kohr-Ah begin actively searching out targets for cleansing, which presumably includes the Melnorme). The fact that it does darken much more gradually seems to indicate what a number of people have said already, that the Metachron accurately predicts its demise only if no action is taken.
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