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Author Topic: Best value ships  (Read 12294 times)
Elvish Pillager
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #45 on: April 06, 2007, 07:47:51 pm »
The proportionality of the costs is all wrong. Now, I said Thraddash are useless, but I'd rather have 50 Thraddash than one Kohr-Ah. I mean, you should be able to get at least _one_ shot in... Roll Eyes
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #46 on: April 06, 2007, 07:53:47 pm »
I know... we might have to half the differences between the ship values, or something.
Alas, at least let's finish the tests!
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Cedric6014
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #47 on: April 07, 2007, 01:41:48 am »
Quote from: Elvish Pillager on April 06, 2007, 04:52:47 pm

Cedric - the main issues I currently have with your new costings are that Kohr-Ah aren't better than Chmmr, and that Ur-Quan and Chenjesu are still overcosted.

So what do u suggest then?
Kohr-ah 32
Chmmr 32
Ur-quan 27
Chenjesu 26?

At least make a suggestion! Every ship WILL have its market value. A what point to you select a chenjesu ahead of a kohr-ah for your super melee fleet?
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #48 on: April 07, 2007, 08:51:18 am »
Values corrected (Ur-Quan beats Earthling, in fact):

VUX 19.5
Ilwrath 23.5
Umgah 6
Ur-Quan 62
Slylandro 60
Earthling 24.5
Shofixti 17
Kohr-Ah 80
Thraddash 1.5
Utwig 58

Thanks to Cedric6014, who has shown me my error.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2007, 09:46:21 am by Valaggar » Logged
Shiver
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #49 on: April 07, 2007, 09:18:45 am »
Cedric's last set of ship values looks okay. I have no idea what Valaggar is doing.
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Valaggar
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #50 on: April 07, 2007, 09:41:58 am »
I'm doing the following:
To find out the value of each ship, try all 25 matchups for that ship and write down:
-3 if the current ship will lose without inflicting any damage
-2.5 lose with minor damage to enemy
-2 lose with half damage to enemy
-1.5 lose with much damage to enemy
0 equal matchup
1.5 win with much damage sustained
2 win with half damage sustained
2.5 win with little damage sustained
3 win with no damage sustained.

Then add all these values.

Now, the cheapest ship (turned out to be the Thraddash) will be a negative value, for example -51; to fix this, add +53 to every value and the cheapest one will be +2.
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Valaggar
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #51 on: April 07, 2007, 09:49:56 am »
Arilou:
Ur-Quan -1
Chmmr -2
Kohr-Ah -1.5
Chenjesu -1.5
Orz -1.5
Yehat -1.5
Utwig -2
Mycon +2
Pkunk 0
Mmrnmhrm -2
Melnorme -1
Spathi +1
Druuge +2
Slylandro -2
Supox -1
Arilou 0
Androsynth -1
Syreen -0.5
Earthling -0.5
VUX -1
Ilwrath 0
Zoq-Fot-Pik +1
Shofixti 0
Umgah +0.5
Thraddash +2

Sum is -21.5, value is -21.5 + 55 = 33.5

VUX 19.5
Ilwrath 23.5
Umgah 6
Ur-Quan 65
Slylandro 60
Earthling 23
Shofixti 17
Kohr-Ah 81
Thraddash 2
Utwig 58
Arilou 33.5
« Last Edit: April 08, 2007, 09:24:42 am by Valaggar » Logged
Shiver
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #52 on: April 07, 2007, 10:35:22 am »
Quote from: Valaggar on April 07, 2007, 09:41:58 am
I'm doing the following:
To find out the value of each ship, try all 25 matchups for that ship and write down:
-3 if the current ship will lose without inflicting any damage
-2.5 lose with minor damage to enemy
-2 lose with half damage to enemy
-1.5 lose with much damage to enemy
0 equal matchup
1.5 win with much damage sustained
2 win with half damage sustained
2.5 win with little damage sustained
3 win with no damage sustained.

Then add all these values.

Now, the cheapest ship (turned out to be the Thraddash) will be a negative value, for example -51; to fix this, add +53 to every value and the cheapest one will be +2.

That's Awesome AI vs Awesome AI, isn't it? That's a bit pointless. The computer is nothing like an amateur player, who in turn is nothing like a veteran player.
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Valaggar
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #53 on: April 07, 2007, 11:03:47 am »
No, it's not Awesome vs Awesome.
It's many things - me vs Awesome, me vs hotseat, me vs me, me vs my brain...
I'd like someone to point my mistakes, though.
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Valaggar
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #54 on: April 08, 2007, 09:48:42 am »
Zoq-Fot-Pik:
Ur-Quan -2
Chmmr -2
Kohr-Ah -2
Chenjesu -1.5
Orz -2
Yehat +1
Utwig -1
Mycon -2
Pkunk -1
Mmrnmhrm -1.5
Melnorme -2
Spathi -2
Druuge -0.5
Slylandro -1
Supox -1
Arilou -1
Androsynth -1
Syreen -2
Earthling +0.5
VUX +2
Ilwrath +2
Zoq-Fot-Pik 0
Shofixti +1
Umgah +2
Thraddash +1.5

Sum is -24.5, value is 30.5;

VUX 19.5
Ilwrath 23.5
Umgah 6
Ur-Quan 65
Slylandro 60
Earthling 23
Shofixti 15.5
Kohr-Ah 91
Thraddash 2
Utwig 58
Arilou 36
Zoq-Fot-Pik 30.5
« Last Edit: April 08, 2007, 01:32:15 pm by Valaggar » Logged
Elvish Pillager
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #55 on: April 08, 2007, 12:32:27 pm »
Quote from: Valaggar on April 08, 2007, 09:48:42 am
Yehat +1
Mycon +1
VUX +2
Ilwrath +2
Umgah +2

How do you figure? I think the Yehat will simply gun you down when you approach, the Mycon will take aim and hit your large hull, the VUX will blast you down with its laser, the Ilwrath will run you over on a gravity whip, and the Umgah will take advantage of the minutest piece of clumsiness, or the planet, or both, the get you.
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Valaggar
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Re: Best value ships
« Reply #56 on: April 08, 2007, 01:32:59 pm »
In fact, the Zoq can spit further than the Yehat and than VUX.
Fot can avoid the 'Wrath gravity whip.
Umgah can't possibly be so good.
But yes, the Mycon can gun you down. Corrected.

Chmmr:
Ur-Quan 0
Chmmr 0
Kohr-Ah 0
Chenjesu +1
Orz -1.5
Yehat +2
Utwig +1
Mycon +1.5
Pkunk +1
Mmrnmhrm +1.5
Melnorme +1.5
Spathi +2
Druuge -1
Slylandro +2
Supox -0.5
Arilou +2
Androsynth +0.5
Syreen +2
Earthling +2
VUX +1
Ilwrath +2
Zoq-Fot-Pik +2
Shofixti +1
Umgah +2
Thraddash +2

Sum is +43, value is 98.

VUX 19.5
Ilwrath 23.5
Umgah 6
Ur-Quan 65
Slylandro 60
Earthling 23
Shofixti 15.5
Kohr-Ah 94.5
Thraddash 2
Utwig 58
Arilou 36
Zoq-Fot-Pik 30.5
Chmmr 98
« Last Edit: April 08, 2007, 03:49:17 pm by Valaggar » Logged
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