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Poll
Question: Which New Alliance race would you surrender to if you were a former Hierarchy member?
Chmmr   -5 (18.5%)
Humanity   -1 (3.7%)
Orz   -1 (3.7%)
Shofixti   -1 (3.7%)
Yehat   -2 (7.4%)
Pkunk (as part of the Yehat)   -10 (37%)
Zoq-Fot-Pik   -1 (3.7%)
Supox   -2 (7.4%)
Utwig   -1 (3.7%)
Spathi (possibly unshielded)   -1 (3.7%)
Thraddash (when not destroyed)   -0 (0%)
Syreen   -1 (3.7%)
Arilou   -1 (3.7%)
Total Voters: 26

Author Topic: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.  (Read 4632 times)
JonoPorter
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2007, 05:43:29 pm »

I would probably thank the new alliance once it reaches my territory for freeing me. Since there was no choice but too serve the ur-quan. I’ve always viewed that an agreement made under direst is invalid from the beginning. And I can see why they would pick battle thralls instead of being fallow slaves. You get too keep your fleet and not have your world stripped of technology.

But if I had to surrender I would pick the pkunk since they have a forgive and forget attitude.

(note: topic totally stolen from BioSlayer. Sorry about that, but it seemed fun to look at things from a different angle  Tongue )
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2007, 05:47:18 pm »

I'd surrender to the Shofixti, and trust that their strict code of honour would prevent them from harming prisoners. After toiling voluntarily to make up for my past transgressions, they'd accept me as a honorary member of their species, and allow me some freedom. I'd spend the rest of my days working with these marsupials, teaching them all I had to give (depends on race).
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2007, 06:39:08 pm »

Just a cursory analysis of the situation makes this entire topic, more or less, just a "what-if" game. Assuming that Zelnick has completed all of the required and optional tasks in the game, there are very few battle thralls left:

The Thraddash and Ilwrath have mutually exterminated each other, or are quickly approaching that point
The Spathi are either members of the New Alliance, or are safely enclosed under their own slave shield
The Androsynth are long gone

Only the Mycon, VUX, and Umgah remain, besides the Ur-Quan themselves. Of the four, surrender from the Mycon and Ur-Quan are not likely to be especially forthcoming.

For the purposes of the remaining part of this analysis, the Arilou are not considered part of the New Alliance; not only did they never officially join, but they would also keep to themselves, and possibly retreat completely into Quasispace for a time until the fighting subsides. As such, they would have no role. Additionally, I am discounting the potential Spathi presence in the New Alliance as well; even if they were available to surrender to, they would blast you clear out of the stars, either for fear (VUX) or simply bad blood and possible revenge (Umgah).

As the VUX, surrender to any New Alliance race is going to be iffy at best. The bad blood between VUX and both Syreen and Humans makes both of those options suicide at best, and slow, painful suicide at worst. The Yehat/Pkunk (considered as one race) are not a particularly good option, either, considering the disdain that the Yehat hold for all VUX besides Admiral ZEX; I don't know how much mellowing the Pkunk influence would have in any case, and I won't speculate. The Shofixti don't seem like particularly good candidates for surrender, because they live to fight, and consider all Hierarchy races targets of their revenge. The Orz wouldn't even allow a surrender, because some bloody idiot asked about the Androsynth one too many times, damning the entire race in the process.The ZFP and Supox will simply turn prisoners over to someone higher up on the totem pole, the ZFP to Humans or Chmmr, the Supox to Utwig. The Utwig and Chmmr would likely each accept a surrender; the Chmmr sympathize with all battle thralls, having been forced to fight against their will (presumably) and are only primarily interested in targetting the two Ur-Quan races. The Utwig have no prior relations with the VUX, and so no reason to harbor any irrational hatreds... yet. If initial negotiations go well, then a chance for survival is in the cards, assuming that the Ultron doesn't offer any guidance to the contrary.

The Umgah have a considerably easier time. Since they don't have decidedly poor relations with anyone other than the Spathi, they're probably safe with surrendering to anyone, save the Shofixti, who would probably still be mad about their role in the whole exploding homeworld thing. Anyone else would probably be a relatively safe bet, even the Orz, as they have had no interactions with the Umgah to date, and may even find them to be *happy campers*, assuming they restrain their violent tendencies long enough to have a chat with them. Then again, surrendering to anyone as an Umgah carries some risk; there is always the possibility that they will feel their surrender is just a "joke" designed to lead to a "funny" outcome where the enemy ship explodes.
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Death 999
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2007, 08:56:29 pm »

I don't recollect a time when the Chmmr were forced to fight against their will.
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Zeep-Eeep
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2007, 09:23:25 pm »

I went with the ZFP on this one. They're a little silly, fairly friendly and, I think, would
treat captives fairly. Then I might finally find out about this sport they play....
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #20 on: May 14, 2007, 09:34:41 pm »

Sounds fun, until you find out that Frungy is played with the decapitated heads of their enemies...
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #21 on: May 15, 2007, 04:07:52 am »

It depends on which race you are.

Umgah:

Surrendering to the Arilou and Humanity would probaly ultimately result in you being let go (and your best 2 choices).  Maybe you get imprisoned briefly but both races do have some sympathy for you.  The Arilou had a relationship with the Umgah prior to the first war, and the Arilou did take the injured talking pet to the Umgah to heal so there is some trust there. 

Humanity might let you live because of your sense of humour.  "It's unfortunate that the Umgah fell so early to the Ur-Quan because I suspect that we would have gotten along well with those big blob creatures, at least it would have been entertaining we know more about them than the other Heirarchy races becasue they were eager to talk to our ships both before, during, and after combat"  ~Cmdr. Hayes
 
Your worst choice would be the Spathi.  They remember the Grand Master Planet Eaters, as well as Jud the Vug.   It's also reasonable that they would blame you for "The Evil Ones"  It doesn't take much for them to put 2 & 2 together.  They do know that "The Evil Ones" didn't evolve on Spathiwa, they did bio-studies on some of them that died of tooth decay from eating sweet Spathi flesh.  Since the Umgah are known pranksters, they're the obvious ones to blame.  The Umgah may be the only race that the Spathi would likely put to death.

The Thraddash would probably kill you, it's their nature.  They did get left behind by the Ur-Quan to guard the flank for 2 reasons, one of them was they kept picking fights with the other slave races like the Umgah Blobbies or those religious idiots the Ilwrath.

The Shofixti would probably kill you too.  Their homeworld was destroyed in the first war, so I think if you're any Ur-Quan thrall the Shofixti put you to death.

Yehat:  They may kill you, because of what happened to their "children", the Shofixti in the first war. But then again they may not.  The worst punishment though would proably be reserved for the Kzer-Za

The Pkunk may kill you if they find out that you were the cause of the Ilwarth attack on them.  But then again killing you doesn't seem to fit with the Pkunk.  They would have reason to kill you though.  2/3 of their civilization was destroyed by the Ilwrath

The rest of the races would probably put you in prison, or turn you over to Humanity.  I don't see any specific beefs with the Umgah from the Syreen or Chmmr (Chenjesu and Mmrnmhrm) and the Zoq-Fot-Pik, Utwig and Supox don't really know the Umgah.  Ultimately though the Umgah would probably be released.

Ilwrath:

If you're an Ilwarth you're probably screwed.  Maybe the Chmmr let you live.  I think.  They did try and defend you during the 1st war from the Ur-Quan.

The Pkunk, may make an exception to their peace loving ways and kill you.  They have damn good reasons to do so.  After all you did destroy 2/3 of their civilization.

Humans kill you for all the Crusiers you melted down to slag in seconds with your Avengers.  They also kill you because they know of your sick sacrifices to Dogar and Kazon, I think they do so slowly and painfully.

Syreen:  Probably mind-control you and make you work on their ships.  Zelnick could possibly convince them to turn you over to the humans, since he's in tight with Talana.  In which case you're screwed.

Yehat/Shofixti:  They kill you themselves.

Supox hand you over to the Utwig who hand you over to humans.  You die.

Thraddash:  They kill you, they thought you were religious idiots to begin with.

Zoq-Fot-Pik, proably put you in prison until they can turn you over to a more powerful race.   They don't really know the Ilwrath so they may not have any specific emnity towards them other than their being enemies.  Maybe you get lucky and they imprison you themselves

Spathi, they were afraid of all the other Heirarchy members, except maybe the Androsynth, they turn you over to the Humans.

Arilou:  Probably kill you for all the humans you tortured and killed during the first war, or they turn you over to the Humans to kill you.  It would be even worse of the bulk of the Ilwrath fleet was thrown against Humanity rather than the Chenjesu and Mmrnmhrm.

Mycon:

Whatever you do DON'T SURRENDER TO THE SYREEN, they will definitely kill you in revenge for your species' destruction of their original homeworld Syra.  Maybe they decide not to be ladylike and even torture you first.  Nothing in their history angers them more than the destruction of Syra.  When told about the deep child that destroyed their world, Talana said that it fills her with BURNING RAGE, but until you had proof don't bring up the subject again because it's too painful for her.  Syreen ge KMS (Kill Mycon Syndrome) and make it your death very slow and painful.

The Shofixti would kill you.  They lost their homeworld in the first war.

The Yehat would proably kill you, they may consider the Mycon's voluntary submission to the Ur-Quan dishonorable.  They may also be pissed off over the destruction of Delta Gorno, but the largest part of their anger on that would be at the Kzer-Za

Humanity:  It's probably cheaper to just kill you rather than construct a prison that meets your life support requirements.

Utwig, Supox, Zoq-Fot, probably turn you over to Humanity.  No specific beef between Mycon and Utwig/Supox/Zoq-Fot-Pik.  IF you're lucky they imprison you themselves.

Thraddash:  They grill you with their Reeunk Afterburners, and serve you with their equivalent to steak. Grin

Chmmr, probably imprison you, let you go after you do your time.  They're coldly rational that way.

Vux:

Don't surrender to the Syreen, Shofixti, or Yehat, because they will kill you.  Syreen for raiding their habitat columns (which was the reason they joined the alliance), Shofixti becaue they will kill any Ur-Quan thrall due to the destruction of their homeworld, Yehat because they love the Shofixti like children, and would either kill you themselves or turn you over to the Shofixti for them to kill you.  They also consider the Vux to be effete and bigoted, and unworthy prey.  This may spare your life. or it may get you killed.

Zoq-Fot-Pik:  Maybe they kill you, maybe they put you in prison, maybe they turn you over to the Humans.  There's no specific beef between the Zoq-Fot-Pik and the Vux so there is some chance of survival.

Chmmr:  They probably just put you in prison.  They don't seem like the revenge killing type to me.

Humans:  They probably don't want to look at you any more than you want to look at them.  Death may be an easier course of action than prison if you're a Vux.  For that reason they may decide to put you in prison.

Spathi:  They turn you over to humanity or imprison you.  They have no specific beef with the Vux, but they are afraid of them.

Utwig/Supox:  They don't have any back history with you, so they probably either imprison you or turn you over to another race that knows you better.

Ur-Quan Kzer-Za stragglers:

Pick the Syreen, you gave them something very big that they wanted at the end of the first war, a homeworld.  Though they hate you with a venegance, this act might get you some leniency.  They probably put you in prison, but they probably don't kill you.

Chmmr:  Maybe they kill you, for taking away their, and their allies, freedom, maybe they put you in a slave shield (talk about an ironic punishment) since they know enough about it to shut one down, they might also be able to put one up.  We know the Spathi can.  I think imprisonment is the more likely punishment.

Spathi:  They're probably too afraid to capture you, maybe they start pressing the FIRE stud wildly.

Humans:  Why surrender to them, a Dreadnought can pound a Crusier, but if you're so badly outnumbred that you would still ultimately lose, it's a crapshoot.  Maybe you are left alive in a prison, but it's probably equally likely that you are put to death.  You did destroy quite a bit of things that humans consider important, and locked them under a slave shield for 20+ years.

The Utwig and Supox may kill you since you did attack them when they came to help you fight the Kohr-Ah, but then again maybe they let you live as a counterbalance to any Kohr-Ah that are still around.

Thaddash:  This has interesting possibilities.  They do have a beef with the Culture 19 original leaders being killed and their nuclear war stopped after Culture 18 fell to the Ur-Quan.  Maybe they find it more ironic to try and make the Ur-Quan their slaves (which would be a really bad idea)

Orz:  I think the Orz kill you regardless of which race you are.  You may also end up like whatever happened to the Androsynth. (this applies to the other races too not just the Quan)
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #22 on: May 15, 2007, 05:25:03 pm »

Quote
I don't recollect a time when the Chmmr were forced to fight against their will.

That was in reference to the VUX, not the Chmmr.
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #23 on: May 17, 2007, 02:39:03 am »

The Supox or Utwig seem like the safest bet.  First, they haven't really had any contact with Hierarchy races--besides the Kzer-Za, and they didn't even really seem angry at them when they were trying to help them.  So they don't have any longstanding grudges.  Second, they seem pretty mellow in general, not the sorts to torture prisoners.  You'd just have to be polite to them and not to insult their Ultron.

The Supox might turn you over to the Utwig, or they might keep you around so they could learn about your culture (I don't doubt they'd be interested).  That wouldn't be too bad.

I'm tempted to say the Orz--if you could get them to accept your surrender, and not just kill you out of... fin--just because they're so fascinating and it would be an opportunity to learn more about them, but there's really no telling what they might do: even if their intentions weren't cruel, it could be incredibly painful and horrific.
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Re: Terms of surrender: The New Alliance.
« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2007, 05:41:09 am »

Chmmr.  They wouldn't likely kill you just because you were coerced to fight.  Goes against all of the logic that at least mechanically-based life revolves around.  Not sure how Chenjesu emotions work.

Second is the Pkunk, of course, but who knows how merciful they'll actually be after their reabsorption into the Yehat.

Although Supox is an interesting choice, but it seem a little demeaning to symbolically say "we had our butts kicked by PLANTS."
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