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Author Topic: Calling all Java programmers!  (Read 7411 times)
dpcamera
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Calling all Java programmers!
« on: September 16, 2007, 08:50:04 am »

Hi guys,

After starting to learn Java this year in my first year of Uni, I've been working on a number of small projects. I've previously worked in VB and C, so coding for Java hasn't been too much of a stretch for me.

One of my projects was the result of a few minutes idle chat with one of my fellow course members. I've previously tried to make a Super Melee clone in C before a few years ago (which was an absolute disaster, as I had no game experience at the time and used far too many abstraction libraries), but my latest project is slightly different.

It's a space game *similar* to Super Melee, but as basic as you can get. All ships are represented as circles, no collisions between ships (yet), etc - but it does allow for different teams, health, etc.

However, the real point of the project is for AI development. Unlike all the games out there, this one's designed for all ships to be entirely under AI control - so you can pit your own AI against others to make it a programming skill test rather than a piloting skill test.

I've only just started on my own AI, but I thought I'd post it here just in case anyone else wants to give it a go - it's quite simple. Also, by all means critique my code.

Before anyone yells, the "IM" (Immutable, without mutator methods) versions of the classes are there to seal off the AI from the game logic. It could of course have been done with inheritance, but using seperate classes created at runtime prevents any cheating. As it's all AI controlled, real-time speed is irrelevant anyway.

Download: http://www.fourwalledcubicle.com/files/Space.zip
Screenshot: http://www.fourwalledcubicle.com/img/Blog/Space.gif

- Dean
« Last Edit: September 16, 2007, 01:31:50 pm by dpcamera » Logged
guesst
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2007, 12:09:14 am »

D'ya hear that? Listen carefully. It's the sound of nobody responding.

See, the folks on this board aren't, generally speeking, programmers. Mostly we just glom onto the talent of others, groupies as it were. Now, don't get me wrong, being a groupie is fine. But when you visit the forums for a web-comic for another series of games and see people making tons of original, fan made, playable, polished games... well, you tend to realize that there's something about star control that just doesn't inspire.

It's sad, but seriously, move along, pal. Move along.
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dpcamera
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2007, 05:57:47 am »

Ouch. Well, ok, guess I'll just go back into lurking.

- Dean
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2007, 09:09:45 am »

See, the folks on this board aren't, generally speeking, programmers.
And those of us who are, suffer from a lack of spare time. I've been toying with the idea of writing an AI for UQM, but there's so much else to code. Cheesy
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2007, 11:22:17 am »

I don't think that was very nice of guesst. A new person comes out of lurking, and the response is basically "go away".

I think it's a nice project, though I don't have the time to play with it myself.
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #5 on: September 18, 2007, 07:29:47 pm »

I also think it's a fine idea for a project. Sadly, I have three full-time projects myself
outside of work which take up any spare time.
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2007, 09:24:18 pm »

I also think it’s an interesting project, and think guest is out of line, but don’t be shocked by anyone’s apparent lack of interest. Back when I was still actively working on my clone I couldn’t even get my friends interested in playing it, let alone their help in making it.

Don’t give up on the project just because of a lack of interest. Any kind of project is a great learning experience and in some cases looks really good on a resume.  Sometimes they don't but they are good for avoiding bad jobs, like I was once asked why I didn’t give any information on the 'open source' company in my resume.
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2007, 09:59:59 pm »

Guesst, at least let it fall off the front page before saying something like that... you did it in 38 hours. These boards are not fast-paced.

I think it's interesting. Reminds me of RoboWar, which is cool. I might even write up an AI to fight yours. Maybe. I have another programming project. The problem is finding anyone who's decent at programming who doesn't.
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2007, 07:19:50 am »

These boards are not fast-paced.

Yeah, despite being about a million times larger than the SCDB, this is still a fairly small and slow board. But it's nice to never have to go looking for interesting threads from yesterday at page 2.

I've had a course in C, but this looks much to complex for me, sorry. Though if you want me to organize the project for you according to ISO standards I suppose I could help Sad
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2007, 07:23:26 pm »

Ouch. Well, ok, guess I'll just go back into lurking.

- Dean
Aw, man. Jerky guesst has been making a comeback. Sorry about that.

Listen, you want people who can kick your can at super-melee, you're in the right place. We'll gladly discuss the finer points of the Utwig mask tradition and Lovecraftian references in Star Control's history.

But as for responding too quickly, hey, prove me wrong. So far nobody's stepped up. I seriously doubt anyone on these forums will. If you want actual programmers who could do this sort of project I'd say check out www.retroremakes.com/forum2 or the forums at www.tigsource.com . Those forums have been awesome in my trying to modivate myself to get back into programming. (I haven't yet, but it's coming soon, I'm sure).
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2007, 10:12:39 pm »

I finally got around to downloading this and checking it out.

I'm not going to write an AI for it because it doesn't seem like an interesting game at all. Because the ships have complete knowledge, the game should degenerate into a stalemate at long range, where each ship could dodge all the shots of the other. At short range, it should degenerate into a contest of who can hit first. Close range is hard to achieve in the first place, since the non-relativistic shots reward the ship that sits back and waits for the opponent to approach.
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2007, 12:45:08 am »

Ok, I'll just continue versing my fellow CS students. No problem.

Elvish Pillager: The AI's don't have *complete* info on the other players, but they do have a reasonably good picture of the others. What knowledge exactly do you suggest I expose about targets to the AIs? Currently you can only see their team, heading, velocity, position and ID number - all the things (with the exception of the last, which is used to keep track of the same ship across multiple AI calls) that would be visible to a human player.

I'm working on getting planets (and associated gravity wells) up and running now. From then on I'll add in asteroid collisions, etc to bring it more in-line with the SC2 melee to make it more interesting.

- Dean
« Last Edit: September 20, 2007, 12:53:19 am by dpcamera » Logged
Elvish Pillager
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2007, 01:40:28 am »

Elvish Pillager: The AI's don't have *complete* info on the other players, but they do have a reasonably good picture of the others.
Currently you can only see their team, heading, velocity, position and ID number
Uh, what can't they see?
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dpcamera
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2007, 02:16:25 am »

Quote
Uh, what can't they see?

Not a whole lot else, but that's not an argument for removing any of the parameters. Can you suggest any of those I should hide from the AI routines, without removing the ability for the AIs to actually function?

The only one I can think of would be to remove the velocity and force the AI routines to calculate it themselves. That won't make too much of a difference however as the same values would be returned.


Quite honestly I'm suprised not at the lack of interest, but the amount of hostility here. This is my first attempt at a real game (if not in the conventional sense due to the fact that it's deliberatly AI-only) and I was hoping for a little guidance from what I *though* was a nice community.
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Re: Calling all Java programmers!
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2007, 03:53:43 pm »

I'm not going to write an AI for it because it doesn't seem like an interesting game at all. Because the ships have complete knowledge, the game should degenerate into a stalemate at long range, where each ship could dodge all the shots of the other. At short range, it should degenerate into a contest of who can hit first. Close range is hard to achieve in the first place, since the non-relativistic shots reward the ship that sits back and waits for the opponent to approach.
Uh, doesn't UQM also give the AI player essentially complete knowledge? In any case, allowing teamplay could address these concerns by giving a co-ordinated attacker an advantage again.
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