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News: Celebrating 30 years of Star Control 2 - The Ur-Quan Masters

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Author Topic: OH... MAI...  (Read 3718 times)
keybounce
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2010, 08:41:51 pm »

Actually, colony management was probably the single worst thing of SC3. If they had done it a little better, it might have been fun.

You really need colonies, and lots of them. You have to make fuel. Since there are plenty of planets where earthlings do badly, and other races do well, you can't just use humans, and you do need to spread the fuel spots out.

(Side note: That 3D universe map was just soo hard to determine distance between two points with, trying to figure out where to place your fuel dumps was a pain.).

And frankly, the human ships stink for me. I didn't rely on just humans because I use the other ships.

But in fairness, you completed it, I did not. I considered it a major spoiler when I found out that even though you only took one kind of Ur-quan, there's supposed to be no others, and no other working hyperdrive, yet somehow the other ur-quan not only are there but take over all your nice ur-quan.

Wouldn't be so bad if you could pilot those other ur-quan ships (nice ships), but noooo....

Oh yea -- even when you discover that the Utwig are using hyperspace, and making raids, your dialog still doesn't let you confront them on it. Stinky bad dialog.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #16 on: July 04, 2010, 08:46:35 am »

Oh my! Can this be? Another living breathing individual who can actually play let alone even TOLERATE StarControl 3? And I thought I was alone in the universe  Roll Eyes

Well anyway, welcome to the Kindred of StarControl fandom! Please, help yourself to the many spoiler safe sections of the site, and also be sure to check out the Pages of Now and Forever, wheres its always fun as whatsitcalled!
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Draxas
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2010, 01:25:50 am »

Played and finished it, back in '96 no less. Doesn't mean I liked it though.

I can't imagine trying to get through the game with only Human colonies. Despite the fact that many of your allies get their productivity knocked way down, it still behooves you to build colonies for them since they remain loyal and don't bail out of the alliance like some others. As such, I had many Syreen, Pkunk and (especially) Utwig colonies, and I kept a fair supply of all the other races around at least for excavations.

Like many things in SC3, the writers did a half assed job explaining why certain things do and don't happen. You can confront the "Kohr-Ah" once they've established a colony, and call them out on being "greens" in dialog. But it doesn't do anything, nor do they explain why they've decided to suddenly change allegiances. You can confront the VUX about their raids, and call them out on their conduct as well. But that ALSO doesn't do anything. So the question remains, why bother? It seems like the designers just stuck these things into the game to make it seem like the Alliance was completely falling apart in order to lend credibility to the Crux as villains before you pick them apart one race at a time. In actuality, the issues with your allies wind up being so contrived and obnoxious, it simply becomes very transparent that they were having trouble writing good scenarios.
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Steve-O
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2010, 10:28:55 pm »

But in fairness, you completed it, I did not. I considered it a major spoiler when I found out that even though you only took one kind of Ur-quan, there's supposed to be no others, and no other working hyperdrive, yet somehow the other ur-quan not only are there but take over all your nice ur-quan.

Not meaning to defend SC3 or anything, but if the two Ur-Quan races had circumnavigated the galaxy before meeting to complete their Eternal Doctrine in SC2, then it's perfectly plausible they may have left outposts behind along the way (especially the Kzer-Za to monitor slave shields, but the Kohr-Ah may have as well, to make sure nothing escaped their xenocide or something.)  Perhaps the sector of space you bubble-jumped into at the beginning of SC3 was one where the Kohr-Ah had an outpost from before.  If that were the case, then the Kohr-Ah were obviously pretty sloppy in that sector since there was this whole Crux thingy that somehow escaped their attention, but I was never trying to say SC3 was well written. =P

Oh my! Can this be? Another living breathing individual who can actually play let alone even TOLERATE StarControl 3? And I thought I was alone in the universe  Roll Eyes

You're certainly not alone.  I played SC3 start to finish myself back in the twilight years of the last millennium.  I actually managed to enjoy it well enough as I recall, although it sure wasn't impressing me as a sequel to SC2.  After having some time to let it sink in I began noticing more and more annoying, generally sloppy things about it.  I also dearly missed the ability to modify the flagship.  Nonetheless, I did play it through, once. =)
« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 10:30:42 pm by Steve-O » Logged
Dabir
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2010, 11:16:51 pm »

Pretty sure the game establishes that some Kohr-Ah were brought along as observers. First chance they get (ie a new colony being made) they take over, and then begin THEIR RAMPAGE OF oh no wait they haven't built any ships yet.
"You will now die."
*booted to space*
...huh.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2010, 12:44:46 am »

Actually, the green Ur-Quan simply mysteriously transform into sort of black-and-green mottled Kohr-Ah wannabes. There's even a dialog choice that calls them out on it, though no explanation for it is given. And no, they couldn't have been existing outposts, because they basically take over Ur-Quan colonies that you built.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #21 on: July 09, 2010, 02:51:42 am »

For some weird reason... I can't open your picture...well, welcome to this forum...I guess...I'm glad you liked Star Control 3 though I've never played it since it doesn't work on Linux.  Though... I AM using Windows Xp right now.
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I'm the kind of person that uses Linux and seems to be a very literate adult but has no idea how to do anything code-wise beyond basic stuff.(such as su -<password> yum install uqm) Except I didn't install UQM that way...I used Add/Remove Software...
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #22 on: July 10, 2010, 12:17:32 am »

I presume the reason they turned was probably an act from the developers to limit the amount of Dreadnoughts that were available to the player because they practically waste every SC3 ship in the game (even Plexor's precursor tub). So they get around this by mutilating the canon and keeping the Ur-Quan to one planet, not that it matters much anyway as the amount of Dreadnoughts you get are enough to win the game with. This isn't also counting Chmmr which also waste every other ship in the game as well but they too get their own little shut down sidestory that you have the option of fixing. It's as if they tease you with the big battleships then shut them down/limit them later in the game to force you to use the small ones but they still manage to utterly mess up in this regard.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2010, 12:20:12 am by Elerium » Logged
Alvarin
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #23 on: July 10, 2010, 12:27:01 am »

For some weird reason... I can't open your picture...well, welcome to this forum...I guess...I'm glad you liked Star Control 3 though I've never played it since it doesn't work on Linux.  Though... I AM using Windows Xp right now.

Mounted ISO and WINE worked without any problems or additional settings...
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #24 on: July 10, 2010, 06:31:30 am »

I presume the reason they turned was probably an act from the developers to limit the amount of Dreadnoughts that were available to the player because they practically waste every SC3 ship in the game (even Plexor's precursor tub). So they get around this by mutilating the canon and keeping the Ur-Quan to one planet, not that it matters much anyway as the amount of Dreadnoughts you get are enough to win the game with. This isn't also counting Chmmr which also waste every other ship in the game as well but they too get their own little shut down sidestory that you have the option of fixing. It's as if they tease you with the big battleships then shut them down/limit them later in the game to force you to use the small ones but they still manage to utterly mess up in this regard.

Not that it matters, since you can make Juggers with comparatively little restriction, and they can easily destroy most everything you run across as well. Plus, later on, you can get the Doog to "defect" to your side, and their ships are the most broken ones in the game.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #25 on: July 10, 2010, 10:47:04 am »

Just wanted to mention the Doogs as well.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #26 on: July 10, 2010, 11:37:29 am »

Mounted ISO and WINE worked without any problems or additional settings...
Where did you get a Windows version of SC3? The only way I've got it to run on Linux is with DOSBox.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #27 on: July 10, 2010, 12:03:47 pm »

It has a "gowin95.exe" file that I've been using for that.
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Re: OH... MAI...
« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2010, 09:55:37 pm »

Actually, the green Ur-Quan simply mysteriously transform into sort of black-and-green mottled Kohr-Ah wannabes. There's even a dialog choice that calls them out on it, though no explanation for it is given. And no, they couldn't have been existing outposts, because they basically take over Ur-Quan colonies that you built.

No, I think Dabir is right. As I recall ,they have a few blacks with them as "observers" that you never met, but they mention that they have tagged along in the beginning. then after things go south, the green black ones take over and all the green ones dress up in masks and smear themselves with dark paint and pretend to be Kohr-Ah. You can still never talk to an actual Kohr-Ah, I guess they're too busy to answer the vidphone.
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