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Topic: How the Kzer-za could have won the war (Read 8585 times)
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Wolframm
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What you say is true, but without the use of the Sa-Matra, the Alliance would have remained in one piece for a much longer time, and then the Kohr-Ah would
arrive and attack the Kzer-Za from the rear. The Kzer-Za would have to fight both the Kohr-Ah and the Alliance. A nasty situation for the Kzer-Za indeed.
They had to get rid of the Alliance before their cousins arrive, and the Sa-Matra was the only way to do that.
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Zeracles
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I think the Kohr-Ah would have been more likely to engage the Alliance than the Kzer-Za. The MO is ``deal with the riff-raff, then get down to business (Doctrinal War)", not the other way. Although I do agree that the outcome of the war with the Alliance becomes a little uncertain if the Kohr-Ah don't behave like that.
Maybe there's a Doctrinal Conflict rule-book somewhere that stipulates the correct action under these circumstances?
Not embarassing, dangerous. The Kohr-Ah wouldn't wait around, they would engage in the doctrinal conflict immediately, and the Kzer-Za would be obligated to respond in kind while still attempting to hold off the Alliance simultaneously. I disagree. As you say, either of the Ur-Quan want to pacify any free sentients who might get in the way before starting the ritual conflict. If the Kzer-Za have deemed the Alliance to be a threat to the conduct of the doctrinal war, the Kohr-Ah probably would too. So I think they'd wait for the Kzer-Za to finish the job. Or help out. The Kohr-Ah may be simple-minded, but that doesn't stop them from being fair.
Yeah, they were winning anyway. They just sped it up. I'm not suggesting otherwise. Of course they're experienced conquerors, and of course they've dealt with organised opposition before. I'm saying that using the Sa-Matra would potentially give them an unfair advantage that the Kohr-Ah wouldn't have had in their position, even though it may not have turned out that way in the end. Which admits the possibility of cheating (to increase their strength for the war with the Kohr-Ah), although as I say, I suspect they had a reasonable excuse.
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« Last Edit: February 26, 2011, 04:44:59 am by Zeracles »
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Fear not the Arch Viles and Spectres of the Deepest Reaches, for the X is strong in this place.
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Alvarin
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Come to think of it, it's strange Kzer-Za didn't use the Sa-Matra more often - it would end conflicts so much faster, saving so much more sentients. They knew they'll face Kohr-Ah sooner or later and beyond the encounter there would be no life, so the faster Kzer-Za progress, the less Kohr-Ah would cleanse. And besides, what's the use of keeping that awesome battle platform, but not utilizing it?
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Grand Master Planet Eater
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Well the queen obviously didn't think so, as she surrendered since she thought they would have no chance of winning
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Draxas
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Basically exactly right. Nobody expected the Yehat to retreat from Delta Gorno before the battle even began, least of all the Yehat themselves.
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Death 999
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We did. You did. Yes we can. No.
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Also, about 'a third of the fleet'... Did you know that the US navy has multiple fleets? That very well could have been the Ur-Quan fourth fleet that got smashed up, just to pick an arbitrary number?
I'm not certain, but I think that's consistent with the source claiming one third. As for the other discrepancy, I believe it went dozens of dreadnoughts, hundreds of ships. The lower-ranking members of the hierarchy took losses as well.
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JudgeYohance
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Also, about 'a third of the fleet'... Did you know that the US navy has multiple fleets? That very well could have been the Ur-Quan fourth fleet that got smashed up, just to pick an arbitrary number?
I'm not certain, but I think that's consistent with the source claiming one third. As for the other discrepancy, I believe it went dozens of dreadnoughts, hundreds of ships. The lower-ranking members of the hierarchy took losses as well.
Let me help clear this up.
So it was the entire fleet not just Ur-Quan Vessels. Also in another line during that conversation they mention that ALL of the vessels sent to Delta Gorno were destroyed. So as far a a battle fleet goes, that entire strike fleet was lost and on the whole, Hierarchy forces were reduced by near 30%. They all state how this was Hundreds of ships and that when the Ur-Quan arrive in Yeaht space, they had a fleet of 1000 ships ready to engage them. I get the impression that the entire Hierarchy fleet musty have been along the lines of 3000 ships total left around this point.
Based on these numbers, I really think that a counter offensive launched at this exact moment between the remaining major powers (Crystal, Robot and Bats  ) could have pushed the Ur-Quan out of alliance space. Now I am making assumptions but if Hundreds (which lets say 200 as a low ball number) were wiped out in Gorno and that was roughly 30% of the entire fleet, then they could only have had roughly 1000 ships themselves left total but since they still had enough to make war on multiple fronts, I think it is safe to assume the destroyed fleet was larger then this. Also the fact that the other races were unaware of the Sa-Matra even after they use it on the remaining alliance powers would indicate they pulled back all battle thralls during those invasions of the home systems meaning the bulk of those losses must have been dreadnoughts. I think it is safe to assume that they likely limited the number of ships any battle thrall was allowed to have in order to minimize risk of revolution among them.
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Of course there are fates worse then death......after all.....you could always make me angry
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