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Topic: Does it bug anyone that is working on this? (Read 20906 times)
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Defender
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i think i opened a big can of worms when i stated where i got my COPY of sc2. if i kept my big mouth shut...oh well, at least you have opened my eyes on the whole situation. but:
in a world driven by greed, its these personal posesions that seperate the poor from the rich. if i am to believe that as a person i cant experiance any thing i want to on the basis that it cost too much money and i cant afford it because someone wants to charge alot of money, then wants the point on living? to strive to be richer? to out do your neighbors, your friends, god? if you cant take any thing with you, then why acquire it at all. because in this world its greed or nothing. it cost money to survive, and people no longer work for themselves(ie like in covered wagon days, but even then you still had to pay for things). of couse you cant any more, why, becasue some one says this land is mine and now you will pay for it and anything else you dont really need. i hope some day that money no longer rings out as the driveng force behind are culture, that we as a people share ideas, items, food because we no longer try to out do everyone else. that whole sharing for free seems to be whats missing from our world. i would feed or house any one in need. and not charge them one red cent. your probley thinking what a fool but its that kind of kindness that is missing in our lives. we have all seen star trek right, well it is my hope that one day things will mirror that fictonal universe. that we strive to better our humanity as a whole and not crush the weak and poor under the capatilistic machine. did i steal to hurt accolade? no, i was angry at what some of you said and i lashed out, but your words ring true when youy say stealing is wrong. i would not take anything that belong to one of you or from your home but like you said i didnt see downloading bits of data as stealing. i may some day stand before GOD and he will ask "WHY DID YOU TAKE THAT GAME WITHOUT PAYING FOR IT?"
i did it because my greed for material items out wayed moral belief that stealing, in this case, was justified on the accounts that i just couldn't find it any where else. but that in itself doesnt nagate the fact that it is, bottom line, not mine and hence forth, stealing. so now what? do i erase it, send accolade a check with um...lets say $20 for sc2, or feel bad that ive may of hurt some feelings and lost some good friends in this forum. i hope that is not the case cause you guys are, for all accounts , the only people i talk to about games and the like. my wife isnt really into all this but thats ok. im willing to draw up a truce if you are and return this forum to a more orderly and friendly talk of sc2 and other related sci fi works. my appoliges to ANYONE i have offended, i get a little hot headed some times but try to stay within light of reason. i guess thats all i have to say bout this.
i hope this gives you all a better understanding into what drives me to hope for and may be it drives you too?
may be some where in this thing we call life, we can pause and ajust or course, even if we drifted a little the wrong way~DEFIANT
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« Last Edit: April 15, 2003, 06:46:55 am by DEFIANT »
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Andy
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Now, as to the "etenral copyright" bit: When you have changed the copyright law get back to me. Until then, no matter how much time has passed, software piracy is stealing.
Um, copyright is not eternal. Right now, the US copyright for software made for hire is 95 years from publication or 120 years from creation, whichever is shorter.
So, assuming the law doesn't change again, is it wrong 95 years from now to copy Starcontrol 2? It wouldn't be illegal. Or is it 5 years from now it's wrong, but 95 years it isn't? Why? Because the law says so? Or is it because 95 years from now Starcontrol 2 will have no value and 5 years it still will? Why 95 years? Why not more, why not less?
Clearly law makers don't think copying software or books the same thing as stealing. Otherwise it would be forever. I mean, it doesn't matter how long my family has owned that diamond ring, when it was made, or anything. If someone took it, it would be stealing.
Similiarly, if you ran into a store, grabbed a copy of some game, and ran out with it, you'd be prosecuted differently than if you copied it from the net.
If I made a machine that made duplicates of apples at practially no cost, nobody would accuse me of stealing from apple growers (except maybe the apple growers.) In fact, I'd be hailed as the savior of mankind, I'd think, eliminating hunger!
Copyrights were intended as a way for artists to make money off of their creations. After they've made their money, those works go into the public domain. I think that copyrights have been extended way too far by corporate greed. Disney has made their money on Mickey Mouse. They need to let him go. He belongs to all of us now.
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ErekLich
*Many bubbles*
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One Ring to rule them all, eh you know the rest.
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Um, copyright is not eternal. Right now, the US copyright for software made for hire is 95 years from publication or 120 years from creation, whichever is shorter.
Um, I knew that... however, for all intents and purposes it is indefinate, because in 95 years it will be impossible to play a game created today as it is today... it would have to undergo major porting.
So, assuming the law doesn't change again, is it wrong 95 years from now to copy Starcontrol 2? It wouldn't be illegal. Or is it 5 years from now it's wrong, but 95 years it isn't? Why? Because the law says so? Or is it because 95 years from now Starcontrol 2 will have no value and 5 years it still will? Why 95 years? Why not more, why not less?
Because, as you said, corporate greed has lengthened the copyright.
If I made a machine that made duplicates of apples at practially no cost, nobody would accuse me of stealing from apple growers (except maybe the apple growers.) In fact, I'd be hailed as the savior of mankind, I'd think, eliminating hunger!
However, as you said, a physical object is not the same as an intellactual one. Stick to one thing or the other. As for the intellectual ones, look at Lukipela's example of photocopying a book -- EVEN an out of print one. It is stealing, for the same reasons that software piracy -- EVEN of an out of print game, is stealing.
Copyrights were intended as a way for artists to make money off of their creations. After they've made their money, those works go into the public domain. I think that copyrights have been extended way too far by corporate greed. Disney has made their money on Mickey Mouse. They need to let him go. He belongs to all of us now.
A couple corrections: After they've made their money, those works SHOULD go into the public domain.
Mickey Mouse does NOT belong to all of us. Disney is still very much making money off of Mickey Mouse, and to make Mickey Mouse public property would lose them money.
and now, a message to EVERYONE!
>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!>!
YES! I think copyrights should be for a shorter time!
BUT! They are not, and copying a copyrighted work without the owner's permission is illegal! No matter what the circumstances, doing so is wrong!
[/soapbox]
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Oh God, please don't let me die today! Tomorrow would be SO much better!
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Niahak
Zebranky food
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Actually, I thought the copyright was extended to 90 some years from the creator's death... Which would mean that if somebody wrote a book when they were 20 and lived to 100 (not impossible, certainly) then the copyright would have lasted for a total of 170 years. An awfully long time...
The problem is that debating on the 'best' length of copyright isn't going to change anything, really.
:-/
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Lukipela
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The Ancient One
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I third DEFIANT's suggestion, we have all stated our opinions, and even though they may differ, we have nothing to gain by bickering any further. (Except that I have to say that concerning Mickey Mouse, why should he belong to all of us now? We didn't make him. But that is beside the point, and again, only a difference of opinions, out of which many can have an equal degree of right and wrong to them I suppose).
I also agree completely with DEFIANT on the subject of greed. However, even though it sometimes sickens me to see the state fo the world today, and no matter how much I would liek to chaneg it, I tihnk that greed has unfortunately always been a, if not THE driving factor for us as a species... Something like that is hard to change, although that of course doesn't mean that we shouldn't do our utmost to do so.
As for the point of living, all I want to get out of it is that when I'm OLD (like preferably 90 or so) and preparing to leave this world, I'll be able to look back and say "I had a good life. I did more good than I did bad, and I always tried to do what was right.". I want to be able to be content with what I've had when I leave, to know that I did the best I could with what possibilities I was given. Nothing more.
And during arguments like these, everyone tends to get a little hotheaded. But still, among friends who mean no harm to eachother, harsh words don't really carry any weight. I doubt anyone here has been truly offended, but if they have, I will gladly add my apologies as well.
And as a final statement, I'm still impressed at how civilized this discussion (just as the war one), has been on this board. It is a rare thing nowadays to be ablet o discuss such touchy topics as these without someone starting a flamewar. That we have succeded is inherent proof of our own maturiyt (congratulations to us!). It is as always a pleasure to read these boatrds.
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« Last Edit: April 15, 2003, 05:11:59 pm by Lukipela »
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What's up doc?
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Defender
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umm...thats a bad, yes very bad, idea... 
i would also like to (just for the record) retract my statement about how to illegaly get sc2 of a certain pirate sharing place. dont do it, its bad, it hurts not only the software companies but you too. if you dont believe just read this thread. you will be a believer.
also ive deleated the name of that *pirate sharing* place in my earlier post. this has been done to protect the guilty, namely me~DEFIANT
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Lukipela
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Slightly off topic, but : You have been busy Primat, haven't you? Two whole pages of new subject, and almost everyone has your name as the last  Way to go!
letting peole do what they feel is right, would be fine, except it doesn't work that well. some people think nothing of murdering, raping, or looting. If you just tell them to go ahead and do it, because they think it's ok, then the world would be in a pretty sorry state at this time.
Whereas on smaller issues like this, the damage caused by ppl who do whatever they want isn't that aggravated (although still bad), in other circumstances it may well be fatal
As for the SC3 thing, the same reasoning applies to all games, and all intellectual property, not just a select few.
And as for actions and consequences. The problem is, most people aren't willing to take the consequences. and sometimes the consequences of your actions affect other people, which you should take into consideration.
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What's up doc?
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